Pushing Democrats To The Left: Richardson Versus Kucinich

by: Chris Bowers

Sun Sep 02, 2007 at 13:00


Right now, two of the Democratic candidates running for President have taken stances decidedly to the left of the rest of the field on Iraq. On the one hand, Dennis Kucinich has openly embraced defunding the war and defeating any appropriation bills that provide for the continuation of war. On the other hand, Bill Richardson is advocating for no residual American troop presence in Iraq apart from those who will protect the American embassy. It is particularly interesting that these two candidates are taking such strong stances on Iraq, given that many would consider Kucinich to be the most progressive candidate in the field, and many would consider Bill Richardson to be the most centrist. It is even more interesting that to date, despite his generally "centrist" positions, Bill Richardson has been far more successful in pushing the intra-Democratic debate on Iraq to the left.

Many would argue that the entire purpose of Dennis Kucinich's campaign is to push the party to the left on issues such as Iraq. However, it has actually been Bill Richardson who has seen his support in Iowa and New Hampshire rapidly rise by putting "no residual troops" at the center of his campaign. First, look at Bill Richardson's website. "No residual troops" has clearly become the centerpiece of his campaign, with three extremely prominent mentions of his stance on that issue on the front page. Next, look at the Iowa and New Hampshire trends at Pollster.com. Richardson has risen from roughly equal to Kucinich in both states at the beginning of the year, to clear contender status in Iowa and equal to Edwards in New Hampshire. I think there is a direct connection here. Neither Iowa or New Hampshire have sizable Latino populations, neither of them are Western states, none of their Democratic members of Congress are in the Blue Dog or New Democratic coalitions, and virtually every Democratic is on the air in both states. In other words, it isn't Richardson's ads, it isn't Richardson being a moderate, and it isn't Richardson taking advantage of favorable demographics in either state. Richardson is rising because of his "no residual troops" stance as much as he is rising because of anything else.

By way of contrast, Dennis Kucinich remains below 5% in every single poll out of Iowa and New Hampshire. Why? Partially, this is because he isn't even bothering to visit either state, as I discussed yesterday. Kucinich has taken more trips to California than he has taken to Iowa and New Hampshire combined. Further, Kucinich has seen a significant drop-off in his contributions from even his 2004 campaign. Back then, at this point in the campaign he had raised $1,760,000 from individual donors, eventually raised over $8,200,000, and ran a hard, full-fledged campaign the entire way through. However, in 2008, so far he has only taken in $1,100,000, despite the national policy mood shifting to the left, entering the campaign two months earlier than he did in 2003, and despite the overall number of small donors to presidential campaigns more than doubling since 2003. Of course, even though he is not running nearly has hard as he did in 2003, he still has no problem accepting debates on Fox News, and blasting any possible implication that he be left out of any debates.

That Richardson has succeeded where Kucinich has failed is, I think, and important lesson for many progressives who wish to push the Democratic Party to the left. The difference I am seeing between Kucinich and Richardson is that Kucinich appears to be a difference between trying to shift the party to the left by getting face time on television, while Richardson is actively forcing other Democrats to come clean on how many troops they will elave in Iraq by leveraging significant support in Iowa and New Hampshire. While Clinton, Edwards and Obama have yet to state how many troops they will leave in Iraq, if the current pro-Richardson trends in Iowa and New Hampshire continue, before long they will have no choice but to do so. At current rates of growth, Richardson will be head in Iowa by November, and leading Democrats will have a choice: either lose in Iowa, or state how many troops you wish to leave in Iraq. Kucinich, by contrast, will continue to show up at debates.

In the end, this is the fundamental reason why I will never support Dennis Kucinich in the primary campaign. He wants to move the discussion to the left, but he is failing to do the organizing needed to actually move the discussion to the left. No one will take your issues and your positions seriously if you do not demonstrate broad support for those issues within the electorate. Bill Richardson may be far more centrist than Dennis Kcuinich, but he is making a more progressive impact on the 2008 Democratic campaign than Dennis Kucinich, and that really is what all progressive should be looking for. To create progressive change, it isn't about finding the candidate with whom you agree on everything, but about finding the candidate who can make the biggest difference on the issues you care about. Dennis Kucinich is fond of using specious survey methods to argue that more Americans agree with him on many issues than any other candidate. However, if more Americans agree with you than with any other candidate, and yet you remain mired in the polls and with far fewer small donors than virtually any other candidate on the Democratic side, shouldn't it occur to you that either you are not he right person to deliver the message on those issues, or that you are running a terrible campaign? You can't change the debate in a campaign if you can't use support of the electorate as leverage. No matter how progressive Kucinich is, he simply is not making an impact on the campaign and that is overwhelmingly his own fault.
Chris Bowers :: Pushing Democrats To The Left: Richardson Versus Kucinich

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I respectfully disagree (4.00 / 1)
Where is your evidence that Richardson supporters are more influenced by his "no residual troops" stand than by his ads?

I've identified a fair number of Richardson supporters and leaners. I doubt many of them could articulate the difference between his position on Iraq and the other candidates' positions.

The ads have been very important for Richardson.

The Richardson supporters and leaner are attracted by his experience, which has been front and center in his ads. He is the only governor in the race, but he also has legislative and diplomatic experience.

It is generally assumed in the blogosphere that Richardson supporters are moderates who would pick Clinton as a second choice. I don't think this is largely true--my sense is that Richardson supporters want a very experienced candidate who is not Hillary Clinton.

Of course, it's possible that the Richardson supporters and leaners I've found in Des Moines and in the suburbs are not representative of his supporters across Iowa and New Hampshire.

Join the Iowa progressive community at Bleeding Heartland.


January withdrawal plan (0.00 / 0)
http://www.youtube.c...

Chris--this is a 2-minute video pulled together from a press conference Kucinich held in mid-January with Jesse Jackson (and Magic Johnson, by coincidence) in NYC.  I know about it because I helped him with it.  In it, we laid out a 12-point plan to get out of Iraq, a plan which goes far beyond Richardson's plan (which, by the way, I agree with).  This was Kucinich's second plan--we released our first one in September of '03--you may remember the punchline, "U.S. out, U.N. in", which we repeated at every debate.  He was widely mocked and ignored at the time, though he was right.  We argue for cutting off the funding because that is the only way to make George W. Bush end this war.  Isn't he correct about that?  (unless you want to add in impeachment proceedings, which he is also the only one who will talk about)...


you didn't address the main point here (0.00 / 0)
and that is that Kucinich is a TV whore.

He does not have real political power behind him. He's all talk an no walk.

Worse yet, he willingly goes on fox news and plays the role of cray-new-aged-vegan-effete-liberal just to get some face time, thereby discrediting GREAT liberal policies such as single payer healthcare [and fair trade].


[ Parent ]
speaking of Kucinich (0.00 / 0)
He did a tremendous amount of organizing in Iowa before the 2004 caucuses.

I have no idea why his campaign has no presence here this time. It may be that when he put out feelers early on, he found that many of his past supporters were on board with Edwards, including his most prominent past supporter, Ed Fallon.

Join the Iowa progressive community at Bleeding Heartland.


disagreements (4.00 / 1)
A sampling:
  *Richardson's numbers start to move up significantly in Iowa and New Hampshire due to his late April, early May TV ads.  The numbers are very clear on Real Clear Politics, for instance--just scroll down the charts.
  *Don't depend on the Post for factual data.  Kucinich has been to New Hampshire second-most of any state, and was there only two weeks ago--not 3 months ago, as their Tracker chart states--at the Portsmouth base, delivering a miltary conversion/infrastructure/no NAFTA speech.
  *Of course Dennis has been to California more than any other state--it was his financial base in 2003, it is again this year, and it is the biggest state on 2/5.
  *On several issues in which Kucinich stands alone among the candidates, large chunks of the public stand with him, and no "specious" survey methods are required--how about single-payer health care, getting rid of NAFTA and the WTO, impeachment, no war with Iran, paper ballots, gay marriage--and ending the funding for this war.  More interesting about Kucinich, to me at least, is that he took these positions without polling, and in the case of his original opposition to the Iraq War and the Patriot Act, in the face of daunting polling.
  I'm trying hard to stick to your points here.  I'm trying to combat a widespread disease on the blogs, a disrespecting of Dennis Kucinich, even to the extent of not giving him credit for progressive issues he has led the way on.  Heck, Chris, if you want to support Bill Richardson, that's okay--I grew up with him in New Mexico politics, and he's a good guy, who's making a strong political point on the war.  But why trash Kucinich while doing so?  Why disrespect the political risks he took to oppose this war, vote against the Patriot Act, stand alone now on single-payer and impeachment?  It seems out of character for your usual writing/analysis, which is why I keep coming back to it.

A major factor--- (0.00 / 0)
It's very difficult to imagine, even for enough time to evaluate the idea, that Kucinich has a chance.  Even if a person genuinely admires & respects the ideas & the efforts, Mr. K is a non-starter.

With Richardson, it could happen.  And, as may actually be developing, the guv could emerge from among Snow White & the Seven Dwarves as a major delegate holder at the convention.

In some ways, I would prefer that.  Legislators have a terrible track record in presidential campaigns.  Governors seem to perform much better.


seconding what others have said ... (0.00 / 0)
Richardson's growth is much more clearly traceable to a spate of early, clever ads, than to his "No residual troops" drumbeat, which in any event is not credible. It is *not logistically possible* to rotate any US military commitment of that size in anything less than a year.

Richardson's site stupidly states that "we redeployed half a million troops elsewhere in a few months." Yeah ... to Kuwait and Saudi Arabia.

Most of the logistical infrastructure in Saudi Arabia, however, has been dismantled, as a favor to the Saudis who were catching crap for housing "infidels" on their territory.

So Richardson's naively envisioned re-enactment of that scenario isn't going to happen.

At any rate, it would be stupid to withdraw all troops to 100 miles away, only to make them retrace every step when things spun out of control again. If the US up and left, what would make an Iraq meltdown any different from the one in Darfur, in terms of justifying American intervention? Let me guess: Richardson has a 10-point plan for that, too.

What will happen is that 30-70,000 US troops will be stationed in military bases in Iraq, safely away from urban centers, to be used only in the event of an overt Iranian takeover of southern Iraq. Obama is being honest with you. Richardson is bullshitting. Which do you prefer?

As Obama has no doubt learned by now, Americans like being lied to no matter how much they bitch about it.

Also, Richardson was a Clinton diplomatic apparatchik. Why should he have diverged so sharply from the Hillary Clinton - Joe Wilson consensus (call it "stay the course lite")? What _specific information_ came to light which caused Richardson to change his mind so dramatically from the Clinton perspective?

Is anyone even bothering to ask?


Which way left (4.00 / 1)
There is a big difference in election analysis and cultural analysis.  Elections tend to be short and rather superficial.  Cultural analysis on the other hand needs to be much more multivariate.  The direction the country is tending does not fit well into an election analysis.  Regardless of how effective his campaigns have been, Dennis Kucinich has articulated a reasonable progressive agenda that has helped move the country to the left.  Bill Richardson has not done that.  In fact it could be argued that his affect on the party has been in the opposite direction. 

How often do we hear someone talking about a Kucinich idea that they really like and they start the comment with "well, of course he could never get elected but…"  It is this perspective that helps keep the country so far to the right. The pragmatist want to argue that suggesting otherwise is being a starry eyed idealist. Like many arguments that take a pragmatic approach, this is an over simplification.  One does not have to believe that Kucinich could win the presidency, not to discredit his ideas before they even put them out.  Political dialog is narrow enough in this country.  Lets not restrict it further by legitimizing only those ideas that come from candidates who stand a chance to make it into the general election. It is a shame that sides are being drawn up so early. It has a very narrowing impact on ideology.  Once sides are chosen ideas become owned and unmalleable. 


Don't love either -- but spare me Kucinich (0.00 / 0)
Look -- I know I'd hate Richardson as President. He's essentially autocratic in style and centrist in substance. But he stands head and shoulders above any of the rest of them in terms of understanding the world in which the US moves. He is the only one of them whose foreign policy inclinations seem to be based in reality rather than cooked up out of fantasyland for domestic political consumption.

Kucinich depresses me; always right on the issues, always futile in a genuine fight. This is a way of being that has given progressives a bad name.

Can it happen here?


Foreign Policy Is Important (0.00 / 0)
But it is not nearly as high on my list. Don't get me wrong, the big picture things like invading other countries is huge and sadly relevant but the complex nuance of foreign policy is less important to me than the issues of real compassion at home. How responsible does the candidate think that our government should be to the health, welfare and safety of Americans is most important to me. 

While I respect Richardson's experience and hope that it is put to use in a Democratic administration, he seems to embrace the neocon paradigm of supporting the WATO and NAFTA and the existing strategy in Israel.

Any president is going to depend on advisers on Foreign policy.  Hopefully a Democratic presidency will seek a wider range of advice than the current administration has.

I too tend to roll my eyes at Kucinich and wish that he would be more mindful of speaking to the general American population. But The Fox News crowd is not going to listen to him no matter what, so he might as well speak from his heart to help move the gravity of our social conscience in a less hawkish and mean spirited direction.  He is speaking to those who will listen to him.


[ Parent ]
Richardson Has Credibility (0.00 / 0)
I think Richardson has been a lot more effective on Iraq because the guy has credibility on foreign policy.  You don't have to like Richardson on every issue but don't forget he is a former UN Ambassador and cabinet Secy.  Like Wes Clark in 2004, when Richardson talks foreign policy people listen because he knows what he is talking about and makes sense.  I don't see Richardson as a President but I could see him as Secy of State in a Dem admin.

Contrast that with Kucinich.  Kucinich is a not especially powerful or distinguished member of the House making his second run vanity run for the Presidency.  Please spare me him and Mike Gravel. 


Kucinich has been made a parody (0.00 / 0)
I'm not blaming him for this, its basically the work of the MSM and any old pundit that opens their mouth.  He has been cast as the "lunatic fringe" the "wacky leftist" - and has been unable to dislodge that label, although he certainly tries very hard. But, the MSM aren't gonna let him change the charactiture they've crafted for him.  Why would they? His failure to ignite solid support in the Democratic party is a reflection of this - its the "electability issue" writ large.  Unless and until he can shake that image, he'll forever be a second (or third) tier contender. 

While I appreciate Richardson's "no residual troops" stance - I don't think it will be possible to accomplish.  I'm not just talking logistics which, as has been mentioned in other comments, pretty much preclude his timeframe.  Even if that were not the case, I don't see how he could get the US military and their supporters in the US Congress to go along with that plan.  So why does he bother talking about it?

It a matter of politics, yes, but its also a matter of establishing his initial position in the coming debate and negotiations in the US Congress, should he get elected.  Richardson has staked out a more "extreme" position than the other contenders (sans Kucinich); they have already begun to concede their positions about "ending the war".  I mean, when does a war end?  Bush told us all that "combat has ended" while posing in front of a "mission accomplished" banner - clearly, that was premature.  But, if the US forces in Iraq are reduced to, say, 10,000 soldiers hunkered down in some US military bases scattered across Iraq - does that mean that the war has ended?  If, at the start of the 2012 election cycle, the US still maintains an "advisor" role in the Iraqi military and national police, can the incumbent Democratic President claim to have ended the war?  My answer to both is "no". 

I take Gen. Petraeus at his word - he sees a 10-15 year timeframe to quell the "insurgency" in Iraq and I think he may be optimistic. Faced with this kind of pressure to continue at least some support for the Iraqi government, military, police, and now particular tribal leaders, I'd chose the Presidential candidate that has the "best" opening stance on this issue.  "Best" meaning the one that is furthest from that of the Bush League. 

I admit, mine may be a darker view of the political possibilities than many on this site express, but I have very little expectation that any of the rhetoric currently espoused by the Democratic contenders will actually be realized during the next President's term in office.

Cheney, Rumsfeld, and their neocon cohorts have dug a very deep hole in Iraq and I expect Bush will continue to dig it deeper right up until the time he leaves the White House.  Why?  Because the deeper the hole, the harder it is to get out of it before the next Republican can be put in the White House to continue (and expand) the US occupation of the Middle East.



"It sounds wrong...
     ...but its right."


There's campaigning, and then there's retraining (0.00 / 0)
(To the comment on Kucinich being an underwhelming power in the House, and vanity seeker for the White House -- then there is his HR 333, fait accompli, (the "Kucinich Measure," my Representative called it, talking with me ... she meant, 'Resolution'), moving to IMPEACH Cheney (first), the only Articles of Impeachment 'on the table.')

Chris, this insight was made in your line, "You can't change the debate in a campaign if you can't use support of the electorate as leverage."

I remember when Adlai Stevenson bettered Dwight Eisenhower on policy, substance, experience, accomplishment, content, in debate ... and IKE changed campaigning, put a new 'cover' on the book.  He started using television ads.

It seems to me that Kucinich could recognize he "can't change the debate in a campaign," and so doesn't aim to.  He aims to change "a campaign."

No TV.  No 'media advisors.'  All internet, all the time.

The premier influence positions of Iowa and New Hampshire may be a campaign 'thing of the past.'  The winning name there, or the other there, hardly has time to be circulated, celebrated, and analyzed, before the next week's primary-power player Supercedes with one punch that drops it.

The rules are changed with so many primary dates moved earlier and compacted.

Maybe 'campaigns' change, ignoring the depth of the 'war chest, and taking measure of the breadth of knowledgeable support.  Where the internet homogenizes knowledge, so everyone knows the same everything about every candidate; and 'spot TV' has neither time (interval) to have effect, nor new information to impart.


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