The Compromised President and Congress: Why this health care bill probably won't reduce costs

by: Ian Welsh

Wed Jul 22, 2009 at 14:00


Ok, I've tried to keep an open mind on this. I prefer single payor, but a properly done public option could, indeed, drive down costs and help some people get care.

But I'm no longer sure I can maintain benefit of the doubt.  First it was the AMA endorsement, which was bought by a promise not to reduce medicare rates as much as initially planned.  Now I read from Robert Reich that the price of pharma not killing it is:

  • Not allowing drug reimportation from Canada
  • Not allowing the government to negotiate drug prices 

The 80 billion pharma promised last month is a small price to pay for that, and I'll tell you right now that that 80 billion won't appear anyway.  As soon as the pharma companies can betray, they will.

The mandate, as Reich points out, can easily lead to insurance companies earning more money than they'll lose, which since the insurance companies are the problem, means that costs won't go down much, if at all.

All in all, I don't think any bill that's going to come out of this Congress is going to be strong enough to drive down costs or even significantly reduce the growth rate.  The mandates, combined with insufficient subsidies mean that many people are going to be hurt by being forced to buy insurance.  The Massachussets plan, which this is based on, has not worked well.  This isn't going to either.

This bill is turning into a pork-fest.  Buy-in is being achieved by making it clear that stakeholders will make more money once it's done, not less.

My biggest weakness this year in doing analysis has been hope.  I have let hope that the Obama administration and a Democratic Congress will do the right thing, and that they aren't corrupt and incompetent, get in the way of clear thinking.  Enough.  Hope isn't a plan, and hope isn't policy.  Hope without good policy is a con-job.  

There hasn't been a good, major, bill come out of this Congress this year.  They have all been fatally compromised, from the stimulus bill (larded up with useless tax cuts and without necessary State relief) to the global warming bill, which is so far from doing enough that it's a joke.

At this point I see no reason to believe this bill won't be the same.  Yes, a few people may get health care who wouldn't otherwise and that matters, but it won't contain costs to any significant degree and it will put a huge burden on Americans who can't afford it.  The likelihood that a surtax on the rich to pay for it won't happen just makes this even more clear.

This is not the Bush administration, but the primary assumption of the Bush years that nothing would get through Congress that wasn't bought and paid for; that wasn't fatally compromised at very best still holds in only a mildly mitigated form.  Yes, Obama and the Democrats sometimes try to do the right thing while Bush almost never bothered, but  the bills that come out at the end are still awful.

This year is effectively over.  Obama's ratings are dropping and will continue to drop as the economy doesn't improve for ordinary people.  In future years he will reap what he has sown: bad policy will lead to bad real results, and Obama and the Democratic Congress will be blamed for that.  They will deserve it.

Hope I'm wrong about this.

But I wouldn't bet on it.  Even hope wears thin over time.

Ian Welsh :: The Compromised President and Congress: Why this health care bill probably won't reduce costs

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You nailed it with this sentence (4.00 / 7)
In future years he will reap what he has sown: bad policy will lead to bad real results, and Obama and the Democratic Congress will be blamed for that.  They will deserve it.

And all done to get brownie points for excelling at 'process', or what he seems addicted to: 'bi-partisanship'

It's as if he keeps a score card and he checks off as 'accomplishments'  when a Republican votes for something rather than getting, and advocating for the best policy to really effect "CHANGE"


Well said (4.00 / 5)
Amazing how silent Dems have been about Obama's strategy of giving corporate power a prominent seat at the table (today comes word that the WH won't release details of the meetings with insurance and pharma lobbyists.) This traces back to the primary when Obama scoffed at Edwards's insistence that corporate power be shut out of deliberations. (Edwards: 'If you give them a seat at the table, they'll eat all the food.")

In fairness, this isn't just Obama's strategy. Ted Kennedy met frequently with industry lobbyists at the outset of this process.

The compromises upfront hurt the final product, and corporate power still works against the best aspects of the bill (a strong public option.) It's not even clear that getting in bed with CP increases the chance of passing a bill, because it deprives Obama of the will-capacity to run strongly against HMOs and Big Pharma. Sure, he mentions "the special interests" and take swipes at the insurance companies but to hear Obama speak you'd think a freshman Senator from South Carolina is the main barrier to real reform.


And, ironically, (4.00 / 2)
The public option proponents have to deal with all the same attacks against "government run healthcare" that they would have if they had actually supported single-payer reforms.

But here's the hope: the amendment to let states experiment with their own single-payer or other systems is still alive.  As someone who works in California, as just one example, I can tell you that the lobbying power of the drug and insurance corps is not nearly as strong in Sacto as it is in Washington.  Though of course it remains formidable.  But if we get the state waiver passed, we can get single-payer passed here.

National Nurses United (AFL-CIO) is America's RN union, representing 150,000+ nurses from all 50 states.


[ Parent ]
isn't it possible (0.00 / 0)
to do that anyway?

"If you want that good feeling that comes from doing things for other people, then you have to pay for it in abuse and misunderstanding..."
Zora Neale Hurston


[ Parent ]
you abosolutely nailed it (0.00 / 0)
especially after reading this bill.  as I stated in another post yesterday, this bill is so full of pork, I don't know how we will ever get an actual cost.  This will not drive to cost of health care down for the average consumer and it all but guarantees the cost going up.  I wish Obama would actually sit down this weekend with a nice cigar, glass of wine, and read this POS.  

It is pretty bad (4.00 / 3)
And while all of us progressives and conservatives, democrats and republicans are battling over policy, ideology, etc, the wealthy elites are soaking up the wealth and consolidating the power.

I had such high hopes that with strong majorities in both the house and senate, and control of the White House that we would finally see some good, progressive legislation emerge that could finally put this country back on the right track.

So far, I have pretty bad buyer's remorse and it is a safe bet that the democratic party and it's candidates will NOT see a dime from me until they earn it.


see, though, we don't have majorities (4.00 / 3)
the Democratic Party is a distraction. actual liberals are a minority in both houses. the Conservative Party* has the most seats. perhaps not complete majorities, but certainly a dominant share. the Conservative Party also dominates the Executive Branch, from the President down through the senior advisers, Cabinet secretaries, and so forth. again, not all of them, but definitely most of them, and definitely the ones with any real power.

* not to be confused with the Friggin Loon Party (R)

not everything worth doing is profitable. not everything profitable is worth doing.


[ Parent ]
True enough (4.00 / 1)
Three parties - conservatives, reactionaries, liberals.  Liberals are the smallest of the three parties.  And Obama is a conservative.

[ Parent ]
Buyer's remorse (0.00 / 0)
Toward McCain or Clinton? Does it even matter?

Do you think the result would have been different had H. Clinton remained in the Senate and taken healthcare reform as her prime initiative?

Spilled milk under the bridge when you come right down to it, I guess.

"It sounds wrong...
     ...but its right."


[ Parent ]
You Don't Spill Milk Under A Bridge (4.00 / 2)
Unless you want to get bit by a troll as you feed it mixed metaphors, while not weeping for me, Argentina, along the old Appellation Trail (so-called).

"You know what they say -- those of us who fail history... doomed to repeat it in summer school." -- Buffy The Vampire Slayer, Season 6, Episode 3

[ Parent ]
Note that none of these blue dogs started barking about health care until the rahmbama game began (4.00 / 7)
Once rahm came out and said that the public option was not a necessity and obama and came out and postured like he was repudiating rahm when in fact his words did not, then rahm's blue dogs all of a sudden came out and started snarling.

Note also one of the blue dogs barking against this the most is darrow or barrow from GA.  obama had a chance to back a progressive black lady in the primary in this blue dog's district and this was a district in which something like 60% of the voters are black, but obama backed the blue dog barrow instead.

Z


the lady was just not ready. maybe next year (4.00 / 3)
but her case aside, Rahm and the boyz backed every right wing pro-war Democrat against an antiwar primary candidate they could find in 2006, and 2008, including some that had a real shot.  

This should really not be a surprise.

"If you want that good feeling that comes from doing things for other people, then you have to pay for it in abuse and misunderstanding..."
Zora Neale Hurston


[ Parent ]
she is not ready but barrrow is .... (0.00 / 0)
... ready to represent big business interests.   Who determined that?  the dem's dlc pimps.  And don't think that rahm didn't have any influence on this determination that this lady was not ready and the blue dog was.  

This not being ready is a bunch of shit.  If she is not ready and barrow is, I'd go with the one that is not ready ... not ready to fuck the American people.

Z


[ Parent ]
here is what I mean by 'not ready' (0.00 / 0)
I was ready to do what I could for her, although I live a hundred miles outside her district.  But being 'not ready" the way I use it means that she didn't have a real field operation to speak of, ad not done a canvass or much of a registration drive.  With not much idea how to raise money and only weeks before the primary, I judged it a hopeless case.

Sometimes candidates like that get it together eventually.  But usually not.

"If you want that good feeling that comes from doing things for other people, then you have to pay for it in abuse and misunderstanding..."
Zora Neale Hurston


[ Parent ]
Thanks for sharing your experience about this situation ... (0.00 / 0)
... you know more about it than I do.

Z


[ Parent ]
Perhaps... (0.00 / 0)
...but, according to Roll Call, Rahm had some "choice words" for the blue dogs at the white house...  It wasn't pretty, apparently...

Rahm may have messed up, but he's still gong to do what the president wants... and there is no way the president wants this right now...

REID: Voting against us was never part of our arrangement!
SPECTER: I am altering the deal! Pray I don't alter it any further!
REID: This deal keeps getting worse all the time!


[ Parent ]
rahm says to roll call: i had some choice words for the blue dogs (4.00 / 2)
The blue dogs are the dlc dem's best friend.  

Z


[ Parent ]
This Is the Plutocracy at Work (4.00 / 6)
This post is right on target.

The health care legislation being considered will not save any significant amount of money because it is not the single payer option favored by 75% of the American people, which is the only real cost saver.

But I also predict that the final bill will not even contain an authentic public option, despite all the valiant efforts of voters and advocacy groups to pressure Congress into including one.

I hope I am proven wrong, but I doubt this will be the case because we can see in the vote-buying preceding the formulation of health care reform legislation that the plutocracy has done what it does best, which was to buy enough votes to ensure that Congress will flout the popular will.

As Dan Eggen pointed out in a Washington Post article yesterday entitled, Industry Cash Flowed To Drafters of Reform: Key Senator Baucus Is a Leading Recipient, the private health insurance monopoly has been flooding key lawmakers' campaign coffers with upwards of $200 million dollars in recent years to make sure that the only legislation passed protects their windfall profits.

BTW, the health care industry is only doing what the financial services industry and the defense contractor segment of the military industrial complex do. They buy the votes of enough legislators in key positions to prevent any bill from getting passed that would have adverse effects on their profits.

Government in the U.S. is plutocracy, not a democracy.

Nancy Bordier is the author of Re-Inventing Democracy. The book can be read free online by clicking here.

A prototype website illustrating how the Interactive Voter Choice System works can be accessed at Citizens Winning Hands.


And this is as good as it will get (4.00 / 10)
As hopeless as this post is, I think it actually underestimates the hopelessness.  Because this is our shot, progressives.  This is it.  The independant voters finally, after eight long years of being beaten down by Republican mismanagement and evil FINALLY gave progressives a shot by electing Obama and giving him majorities in both houses.  

If they don't see change...real change in the next four years, many of them will no doubt be wooed back to the dark side with its promises of low-tax faries and freedom rainbows.  Unless something in the political world changes drastically in the next four years this is as liberal as the US electorate is liable to get.

I've had enough of Hope.  What I want to see from our leaders now is some Faith.  Faith in the Progressive Way.  Faith that our way is better than the way of corporatist, DINO, DLC, Third Way sellouts which has been tried and tried and tried and failed just as often.

Obama and the Democratic leadership need to boldly shove progressive policies down the throats of the Blue Dogs and Republicans.  If we're going down we should do it based on OUR policies, not theirs. Whichever policies we choose, should they fail, America will blame liberal Democrats for them, period.  Corporate media is still too strong, Americans still too illiterate to understand the political realities behind the construction of the policies.  They will blame US.

I just hope that the signs we've seen lately of an Obama willing to stick his neck out for health reform means he won't sign a crappy bill just to get one signed.  I guess it's my turn, once again, to have some Faith and some Hope.


[ Parent ]
Wrong, although it may need to get worse before it gets better (0.00 / 0)
The way I see things (and Nancy and others would agree), we have the votes to do much better against the plutocracy. And we will - provided the government doesn't simply get so fascistic that it suspends the Constitution, and elections.

It's a shame that an e-democracy consensus building tool is not already in place. There's a lot of "buyer's remorse" that could be properly channeled....

DemocracyABC.org
TheRealNews.Com
http://www.pdamerica.org


[ Parent ]
What scares me is that we'll likely get (0.00 / 0)
an anti-plutocracy right-wing demagogue in 2012 against Obama.  Ron Paul or Mike Huckabee would both fit the bill, and both would be disastrous.  

[ Parent ]
I'll bet Obama wins in a landslide (0.00 / 0)
The last Pew poll reported that the Republican self-identifiers are down to only 22% of the electorate.

Independents were 39% and Democratic self-identifiers were down to 33%.

Given the deliberate efforts Obama is making to bring Independents into his fold, I am confident that he is going to win re-election no matter how or how much he and the plutocrats in his administration and Congress screw the American people on the core issues.

If he weren't already plotting his re-election strategy, he would come out strongly in favor of the public option and hammer Congress to include it in the final bill.

Nancy Bordier is the author of Re-Inventing Democracy The book can be read free online by clicking here.

A prototype website illustrating how the Interactive Voter Choice System works can be accessed at Citizens Winning Hands.
                 


[ Parent ]
I'd say from your lips to God's ears... (4.00 / 4)
But Obama blew it from the start by picking Summers and Geithner, two people who helped build the system that crashed. Summers, in particular, comes across as an intellectual lightweight (compared to Stiglitz) who is full of himself. The perfect Bushie, come to think of it. Instead of changing course, Obama chose the status quo. Or worse, if having few Goldman Sachs doing the same financial shenanigans, only charging more for their services, getting more powerful.

This same bias for the status quo is all over health care. It's great that Obama talks about a public option. But he has never supported the least costly option, single payer, which says a lot about where his heart and values lie. And I've not really seen Obama talk to the public the way Reagan did on TV to push his tax cuts years ago. Clearly everyone but the public has health care which means our views are not heard in the media.

Progressives need to continue their war of attrition against the corporate whores in DC by electing progressives every chance we get. If health care fails, in theory, there should be plenty of anger in a lot of Blue Dog districts in 2010. Hopefully progressives can help run solid candidates against them, early and often for the next 10-20 years.

That said, the fish rots from the head. Pelosi seems mostly competent but Reid appears hopeless. The outcome of all this is, sadly, uncertain. The options are right wing fascism, more corporate control of our government, or progressivism.

I'm happy to help pressure Obama but he clearly is a weak vessel. I don't see him ever being more than Bush Done Right. Like many people, that's not what I voted for.


[ Parent ]
I love this: (0.00 / 0)
...many of them will no doubt be wooed back to the dark side with its promises of low-tax fairies and freedom rainbows.

A lot of truth being told in your entire comment here, friend of beer.  

We the People...participating in our democracy again!


[ Parent ]
so is the Obama health care thing better than nothing? (4.00 / 2)
For so long single payer advocates have been told, and were persuaded to tell each other that by standing up for single payer they were making the good the enemy of the perfect.

Now it doesn't even look that good.

Medicare took 11 months to roll out and cover 40 million seniors back in the day before they even had computers.  If the Obama plan takes till 2013 to cover maybe two thirds of the fifty million uninsured, its public option has been eviscerated and shrunk to 9 or 10 million, and the whole thing is just the crappy Massachusetts plan going national, why is it better than nothing?

If it passes, the debate is shut down for a decade, the idea of "public" anything is discredited, and the insurance vampires get another decade.  If it doesn't, and we have to dance again next year, what have we lost?  

Just askin'.

"If you want that good feeling that comes from doing things for other people, then you have to pay for it in abuse and misunderstanding..."
Zora Neale Hurston


Also note that Medicare started out as single payer, too (4.00 / 2)
and that the Medicare outcome was a compromise.  Social Security was supposed to include universal health care, and that got shot down.  

[ Parent ]
That's not the Obama plan... (0.00 / 0)
...that's the house plan, and even that version of the public option is in jeopardy right now...

BTW, the reason why it starts so late is because of the CBO scoring... only way to keep it deficit neutral, which is necessary for reconciliation..

REID: Voting against us was never part of our arrangement!
SPECTER: I am altering the deal! Pray I don't alter it any further!
REID: This deal keeps getting worse all the time!


[ Parent ]
Well not entirely right (0.00 / 0)
The House Bill establishes a reasonable timeline that cannot readily be compressed, it is not all about cost.

The plan starts the clock at enactment and allows for up to a year to get the Health Benefits Advisory Committee to be appointed and present a set of recommendations to the new Commissioner. The Commissioner has up to 45 days to review the recommendations and a limit of six months to move them through the statutory set regulatory approval process. At which point contract negotiations can begin with providers wanting to participate in the Exchange.

During this up to 18 month process they will be busy setting up the new Health Choices Administration and getting its Commissioner nominated and approved. If all of these administrative and hiring pieces could be assumed to go perfectly you could squeeze at most a year out of the process and so go live on Jan 1, 2012, It is not just as easy as passing a bill and writing a check.

On something this important I don't think you just want to slap-dash throw something together on the run, in part because you can bet Republicans will be keeping an eagle eye on everything hoping for some "I told you so" moments.


[ Parent ]
I Honestly Don't Know (4.00 / 3)
Bruce asks:

If it passes, the debate is shut down for a decade, the idea of "public" anything is discredited, and the insurance vampires get another decade.  If it doesn't, and we have to dance again next year, what have we lost?  

I'm honestly not sure what to expect going forward either way.  I just think that there are too many variables.  If the Dems fail to do anything will it be another 1994?  No, I don't think so.  There's a different long-term dynamic now than there was then.  But can we be sure we'll really get another chance?  I don't think that's certain, either, though I tend to agree (and my heart dearly wants to agree) with Bruce.

Also quite important, with such a long roll-out time, can we be sure there won't be time for a major fix before 2013?  Again, I don't think that's certain, either.

Bottom line, I don't think anyone's got reliable crystal balls lying around.

So, in this state of radical uncertainty, why not just do the right thing?

What does that mean?  Whatever you think it means:  The right thing, rather than the expedient thing.  And I say that as someone who's a great idealist, but is still quite willing to compromise when compromise can lead to a clear path forward.

That, perhaps, is Obama's greatest failing:  he's made it virtually impossible to see beyond the moment, when his core appeal to "change" is so vitally dependent on doing precisely that.

"You know what they say -- those of us who fail history... doomed to repeat it in summer school." -- Buffy The Vampire Slayer, Season 6, Episode 3


[ Parent ]
If the final bill is not acceptable (0.00 / 0)
Call for a veto and make this the major issue of the midterm elections. If the polls are accurate, the public would support this approach. Political will is lacking. Obama has the political campaigning skills to consolidate public support, right?

Who loses in this scenario?


"It sounds wrong...
     ...but its right."


[ Parent ]
That's a HUGE risk by Obama (4.00 / 4)
because if no bill gets passed (or an override happens, which is also possible, if the Republican sense an opening), then it's on him that there was no Universal Health Care passed, and UHC was a campaign promise that can be hung on him.

It would be bold and brave and different.  It would be all of the things he promised that he'd be in the campaign.  It also would be contrary to all of the instincts he's shown thus far.


[ Parent ]
I'm not claiming he'd come to this decision on his own (0.00 / 0)
but if too few Democrats in the congress manage to show their spine on the issue, we all know where the buck stops: with the leader of the party that sits in the Oval Office. Perhaps President O needs to be reminded of this fact. Everyone in the M$M/Noise machine is gonna call it "Obama[you know what]" so why not embrace it and run into your legacy.

As Ronald Reagan's supporters have reminded us, there is room on Mt. Rushmore ;)

"It sounds wrong...
     ...but its right."


[ Parent ]
As things stand now (0.00 / 0)
I think we are going to get destroyed in 2010. If Obama fails on Health Care he will be broken.  

2012 may be a different story.

The only way to get even the change Obama wants is to blow away the filibuster.  There are simply too many deep red states to make getting 60 liberal votes in the Senate likely.


[ Parent ]
Can we make pre-emptive ads, targetting the Progressive bloc? (4.00 / 1)
I'd like to see that. The idea is to keep them honest, not to attack them. (Though I have no problem with taking a swipe at Obama. Doing so could help the ad go viral over the internet.) Viz, the ad would say that if the legislation requires "Not allowing drug reimportation from Canada" and "Not allowing the government to negotiate drug prices", etc., the right thing to do is to vote against bill. I'd also throw in a sentence about the desirability of single payer, which is not even on the table, but should be allowed for states.

DemocracyABC.org
TheRealNews.Com
http://www.pdamerica.org


the only question is (0.00 / 0)
who's got the stones and the cash to do it?

"If you want that good feeling that comes from doing things for other people, then you have to pay for it in abuse and misunderstanding..."
Zora Neale Hurston


[ Parent ]
Reich's Flawed Assumption (4.00 / 3)
His post implicitly assumes that the final bill will come out of conference shaped entirely by whatever compromises Baucus makes to get it out of Finance as opposed to moving in the direction of the House Tri-Committee and Senate HELP versions already mostly advanced to the floor.

Why is he and by extension us defining 'Obamacare' as the Senate Finance version instead of the House Tri-Committee Bill?

In my mind the key is going to be in the comparative scoring. The Tri-Committee bill, once some final legislation on Pay-Go is passed will score as deficit neutral by CBO. In fact Pelosi and Rangel already claim it meets that test. This gives Baucus a benchmark to work against. Every concession to Big Pharma simply drags down his CBO score and can only really be compensated for by covering lower percentages of the currently unemployed.

It is quite possible that we will go into August with the House having passed a complete bill that scores as fully paid for by CBO and covers 97% of legal Americans. Do Senators really want to go home and tell constituents "Well yes we could cover more people at a cheaper cost like the House bill does, but that would be so unfair to the CEOs of the insurance industry and Big Pharma"


Yes (4.00 / 2)

Do Senators really want to go home and tell constituents "Well yes we could cover more people at a cheaper cost like the House bill does, but that would be so unfair to the CEOs of the insurance industry and Big Pharma"

Of course they will.

[ Parent ]
well (4.00 / 1)
more precisely, they won't tell them, but nobody else will either, and in most cases, even if they did tell them, they'd still get re-elected, because who else will there be to vote for?

not everything worth doing is profitable. not everything profitable is worth doing.

[ Parent ]
Great piece! (4.00 / 1)
I have many friends who are healthcare advocates who gave up on singlepayer this year to focus on the nebulous public option.  The problem is, when you give up in advance you have no bargaining power.  I certainly didn't see AHIP of PhARMA giving up in advance, or even yet.  There is a genuine concern this bill will actually increase insurance profits, which is just crazy....

National Nurses United (AFL-CIO) is America's RN union, representing 150,000+ nurses from all 50 states.

This is the worst article I have ever seen on openleft. (4.00 / 1)
An incitement to inaction, a deeply weepy piss poor sob fest of why isn't it easy.



Change
"We must break up the banks and never again let them get so big that they distort our politics and take down the economy.


It's hard to make (4.00 / 1)
a man understand something when his job requires him not to understand it.

[ Parent ]
My job (4.00 / 3)
isn't to incite to action, my job is to tell the truth as I see it.

[ Parent ]
The purpose to studying the world is to change it. (0.00 / 0)
I can laugh at a butterfly, I enjoy a meal and my grandchildren give me as much pleasure as anyone's version of heaven. But looking at the world is act that is deeply embedded in a verb of making it more perfect.

A weird old geodesic dome guy, R. Buckminster Fuller, once said (almost to me) If you are going to grow up, look around you, and see what needs to be done, and do it.

I certainly dont want you do anything less than you do, reporting accurately is more than most do.

Change
"We must break up the banks and never again let them get so big that they distort our politics and take down the economy.


[ Parent ]
Well, it's not that I never (0.00 / 0)
try to incite to action.  I have in the past, and probably will in the future.  But I see my first job as "tell the truth as I know it".  If people lose trust that I'm doing that the calls to action suffer.

[ Parent ]
We need truth tellers, and we need inciters of action (0.00 / 0)
It's nice to get both, together. However, implying that they must always go together, often strikes me as a ploy to get somebody to shut up, who is telling an unpleasant truth.

DemocracyABC.org
TheRealNews.Com
http://www.pdamerica.org


[ Parent ]
Bad Governance (4.00 / 1)
I don't like Obama's "middle of the road" approach anymore than most of the commenters here. But, I do think, in the final outcome, that Obama will not settle for bad governance. I think he'll do his best to create a good administrative structure out of whatever is the best legislation he can get out of congress. Certainly he will not want to be blamed for an administrative disaster that will result in angry voters and wasted money.

Bush did not care. The GOP passed medicare part D, and all that crap that could never work well, and that was fine with Bush. Prostitutes for the Dept. of the Interior were also fine with Bush. The executive branch has a lot of latitude to make the best or worst out of legislation passed by congress, and Obama will use that latitude to make the government work better.  


yes, yes (4.00 / 1)
he's better than Bush. I hope that doesn't turn out to be the best we can say about him.

[ Parent ]
Shouldn't we have a higher bar (0.00 / 0)
than George "Worst President Ever" Bush? Aim high.  

"It sounds wrong...
     ...but its right."


[ Parent ]
Agreed. "Second Worst President Ever" is not very flattering (0.00 / 0)
[ Parent ]
why do we continue to support him? (4.00 / 1)
I want to seriously ask this question, why does the left and especially the progressive blogs continue to "support" obama and pretend like he is on our team? I dont want to go through a list of his apostasies because everyone here knows them all. but if he fucks up on health care which now, seems probable, whats the point? The growth and agility of the progressive blogs over the past 10 years has been amazing, i really an glad to be apart of this community, but obama's policies are not our policies. he will fail because his ideas suck, and i think he will be a dead weight if we continue to carry what limited water we do cary for him. Progressive are on the way up, and i feel that in a generation we could be in complete control of one of the major political parties. yes, right now we are small, and have no power, but i dont want obama's failures to be ours as well. Obama is a self-admitted new democrat, he is a relic of a bygone era. we dont that anymore. after everything  that happened under bush the best we can do is obama? we arent a serious movement. we need a clean break( as best we can)  and obama doesnt provide that.



[ Parent ]
Right, and... (0.00 / 0)
I think the only way the health care reform was ever going to rebuff the wiles of private insurers and big pharma was if we went to a Single Payer system. there is still SOME hope for it, thanks to Kucinich and Sanders, an amendment is attached to the bill (or will be in the Senate) that allows the states to institute their own Single Payer system and there are currently about a dozen states that are just waiting with their bills to do so in hand. As Kucinich has correctly pointed out, this is precisely how it came to be in Canada, one province at a time.

The only thing I wish I would see more Progressives talking about is the burden that this public option is placing on our businesses and our employers. You hear the right-wing yelling about the burden of taxing our employers; but the truth of the matter is that leaving health care as a responsibility of employers is the BIGGEST burden of all! I mean, we hear everybody talking about how we can't deal with health care now because of the economic mess; but again, the truth is that we will not be able to compete in the global market as long as twice as much of our GDP is being eaten up by health care costs!!!

And for crying out loud, Single Payer would not only cover 100% of Americans, but would SAVE us money to boot. So when I hear Obama say tonight that 97% will be covered and it's "deficit neutral" I say, NOT GOOD ENOUGH! On the other hand, I like that he slipped in that "The only way you can have everybody covered is with what's called, Single Payer."  

We the People...participating in our democracy again!


PS ... (0.00 / 0)
Until we can get some campaign finance reform, then the onlhy means we have of fighting off the special interests ids by banding together. Now that we are so close to this bill process coming to a close, I recommend we come together so we can make some NOISE about our needs. hopeful we can make a big enough stink that Congress may not get away with so much of this BS.  

Here's one way that The People's Voice is being delivered to DC:

http://www.Walk4Healthcare.org

You can follow and support through Facebook & Twitter as well.  

We the People...participating in our democracy again!


[ Parent ]
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