Saturday Evening Death Panels Open Thread

by: Paul Rosenberg

Sat Aug 15, 2009 at 19:30


There's a poll attached to this diary, even though I can't see it from the front page.  I haven't done a poll in eons, so I don't recall if that's normal or not.  But you really should join in.

And tell us what's on your mind after you've voted.

Paul Rosenberg :: Saturday Evening Death Panels Open Thread
Poll
When It Comes To Death Panels, Which Do You Favor?
Mahogony
Plywood
Teak
Ironwood
Redwood
Formica
Gold Plate
Blue Plate

Results


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Saturday Evening Death Panels Open Thread | 35 comments
No Wormwood? (4.00 / 2)

Dang! (0.00 / 0)
I had several dozen ideas that flooded in and quickly exited my mind.

That's always the danger of doing stuff like this on the fly.

But, OHOT, at least it got the comment thread started.

"You know what they say -- those of us who fail history... doomed to repeat it in summer school." -- Buffy The Vampire Slayer, Season 6, Episode 3

[ Parent ]
Bamboo (4.00 / 3)
I prefer bamboo death panels on my suicide doors.
rims? (0.00 / 0)

I chose redwood (4.00 / 2)
I put it on my house and it has done well and lasted a long time.......so may as well have it on my death panel.

I spent the last week or so debating a cousin I really care about over healthcare.  He is a really nice guy, good man.  He's about five years younger than I am and when we were kids, I occasionally took him to see the Phillies play in old Connie Mac stadium, or just any place with a couple of my younger cousins for ice cream, etc.  

We both went to the same catholic schools.  I grew up, became a left wing agnostic; he grew up and became a right wing evangelical.  Go figure.  

No matter what statistics I give him, no matter what reference I site, he says the same thing: I just don't want government running things (but he is planning to go on medicare when he can).  He supports Sarah Palin.  It saddens me to hear him.  He has a right to his beliefs but still.....I just don't get it.

Don't Give him any statistics at all (4.00 / 5)
According to Drew Weston in The Political Brain, we always lose the argument when we try to be rational.  Talk in terms of values and emotions.  That's what I've learned in the first few chapters anyway.
[ Parent ]
What do you do with a death panel? (0.00 / 0)
I choose Formica, because it sounds like it would have the heft needed to cause death.

Of course, all I know about the Formica is the name. ... And I might be mispronouncing it.

Formica.

I like that name.

If I ever join a band, I'd call it The Formica Giants.

My Sister (0.00 / 0)
Used to say, "Knock on formica", which is why it made it on the list.

'Twas her ironic take on growing up in suburbia showing through.  

I must say I'm impressed with how well it's doing.

"You know what they say -- those of us who fail history... doomed to repeat it in summer school." -- Buffy The Vampire Slayer, Season 6, Episode 3

[ Parent ]
Popularity (4.00 / 2)
I think people are voting based on how fun it is to say the name, because Teak is also a fun word to say.

George Formica and the Golden Teaks.

That would be an awesome name for a band.  

[ Parent ]
Either That Or (4.00 / 1)
Anne Teak and the Four Formicas.  

"You know what they say -- those of us who fail history... doomed to repeat it in summer school." -- Buffy The Vampire Slayer, Season 6, Episode 3
[ Parent ]
My brain first read "Gold Plate" as (4.00 / 1)
"God Plate",  so my first instinct was to choose that one since it seemed the natural choice for anything with "death" in the title. I ended up choosing "teak", which, as of this moment, has me in the majority of something, for a change (currently leading with a whopping 7 votes!).

I do have something on my mind, but I'll type it out in a separate comment.

OK, this is the latest strategerie running through (4.00 / 1)
my brain, and I'd like to run it by you all and see what you think:

It concerns the "framing" around the pro-public option movement. Right now in terms of action, we have "The Pledge", where we ask members of congress to pledge to vote against any "reform" bill that doesn't contain a strong public option. That's fine for holding pols' feet to the fire and trying to get them on the record to commit, but it's not so useful as a "frame" (not that it's intended to be, of course). The Pledge is a great action, but you have to explain to people what it is, so it's doesn't work as a "frame". My feeling is we need a really good "frame phrase" to get the idea across that we won't settle for anything less than a strong public option (which is, of course, already the compromise position).

We have to get out ahead of the curve in case Obama and Co. cave and agree to a totally compromised "bipartisan" bill. If that happens, members of the Progressive Caucus (and their allies) are going to feel tremendous pressure to "support" Obama and vote for it, no matter how bad it is. We have to let them know well in advance and in no uncertain terms that we absolutely support them voting "No!", and will not punish them for not "supporting" the President.

So here's my question: In conjunction with The Pledge, should we start a "Just Say No to Phony Reform!" campaign? And if so, what's the best way to go about getting it done?

Slogan (4.00 / 1)
Here's my slogan...

"Medicare for Everyone!"

People seem to like medicare, so why not try and simply expand it to include everyone. I think that would be a much easier sell to 90% of the population.  

[ Parent ]
Yeah, that's a good slogan, but it's a different strategic matter (0.00 / 0)
than what I was talking about.  
[ Parent ]
Excellent question. OG (4.00 / 1)
No mandate without public option - is my very bottom line. And the trigger should be well over 400 percent of poverty... every member of the public should have the damn option. Plus, government subsidies should not prop up private insurance.. if one requires assistance for coverage.. they should be under the public option only.

Since that or better has about negative 270 percent chance of happening.

Kill the bill

Hey congress, go back to reform school!

Feel this, buster!

Deep Six this bad fix

Scrap this crap

No double Blue Cross

The best wealth is good health

I could go on and on.

Yes, this scenario is on my mind tonight. We should definitely be very prepared to make them say / vote no.. or start the heck over. This pass anything and call it a victory, meme... is pure BS... and it's everywhere.

Anyone else watch Bill Moyers this week? Frum was far more interesting than the first segment (which was a complete mess). Frum's closing in on some new GOP angles we should all be aware of. imo. I was hoping Paul and others might have something to say about it this weekend.

Health Care not Insurance Fare

[ Parent ]
Thanks for your feedback, Springs (4.00 / 1)
And I like a lot of your slogan ideas, esp. as a tag line to the "main" (explanatory) frame of my "Just Say No" idea. So it would be something like this:

Just Say No to Phony Reform!
Deep Six this Bad Fix!

(or Scrap this Crap!)

I also really like "Kill this Bill", but it's vague on the angle - could indicate anti-reform sentiment instead of wanting good reform. And thanks for the Frum head's up.

[ Parent ]
Since there's no Oak or Maple (0.00 / 0)
I choose Mahogany. I think it's used for furniture, and not for siding like redwood, but it has an elegance that I like. Might as well go out in style!

Here are two pronunciations of "formica." Wonder if this is how C.S.Strowbridge thinks it sounds?

Pronunciations (0.00 / 0)
"Here are two pronunciations of 'formica.'"

Are you sure about that? They sound identical to me.

I think the first one is just said a little slower than the second.  

[ Parent ]
The second one is crisper (0.00 / 0)
But there ARE two to listen to, that was my meaning...
[ Parent ]
Crisper. (0.00 / 0)
Crisper. That's a good way to describe it.  
[ Parent ]
Yeah, how could Oak not be an option? (4.00 / 3)
That's so not right!
[ Parent ]
i don't think he likes you OG (0.00 / 0)

[ Parent ]
Heh! (0.00 / 0)
And just about any shortening of my name besides "OG" is preferred, thanks.
[ Parent ]
don't conceal your inner "original gangster." (4.00 / 1)

[ Parent ]
Has nothing to do with Original Gangster (4.00 / 1)
and I was afraid you might think that. No, it's just that the letters O and G together are incredibly unappealing to me. Sound like an ape grunting or something.  
[ Parent ]
Petrified wood (don't pull the plug!) (4.00 / 3)
Ash

dead wood

sick-a-more

hollywood death panels, ftw. (4.00 / 2)
as a surfer, i must say, that is one sweet woody.
Can You Believe? (4.00 / 1)
My dad had a woody and my mom had a '57 Chevy.

Now, how cool was that?

Both bought for purely practical reasons, too.  Absolutely no sense of style in automotive matters. Just blind dumb luck.

"You know what they say -- those of us who fail history... doomed to repeat it in summer school." -- Buffy The Vampire Slayer, Season 6, Episode 3

[ Parent ]
Balsa wood 0,1" (3mm) (4.00 / 1)
For the modellers and those who are generally against death panels. With thin balsa wood slabs, you can build a death panel that will look like the real thing but still ensure that it will be totally unusable!
:D
i can't believe (4.00 / 2)
pine wasn't an option. as in "cheap pine box." the kind the poor are buried in, after their lives are tossed away by society and the govt is forced to provide burial service for them.

morbid! i guess i'm just in a goth mood cause of the music i have on right now. i went with mahogony. altho technically i think it's pretty un-PC to use it right now, over harvested as i think it is.  

Good point! And what about cardboard? (0.00 / 0)
Isn't it often used as a cheap discount alternative, too?  
[ Parent ]
See My First Response To Mark Matson (0.00 / 0)
I quite literally wrote this diary in five minutes.

You're supposed to write a diary like this in six minutes.

My bad.

"You know what they say -- those of us who fail history... doomed to repeat it in summer school." -- Buffy The Vampire Slayer, Season 6, Episode 3

[ Parent ]
My Death Panel would be made of Insurance Bureaucrats (0.00 / 0)
I'm an old-fashioned sort.

"It sounds wrong...
     ...but its right."
LARRY SUMMERS AND COST-EFFECTIVENESS (0.00 / 0)

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/30...

DR. SUMMERS:  The president's laid out a number of measures on the tax side and in--and much more importantly, a number of measures that involve taking costs out of the Medicare, the Medicare budget.  But the really important issue for the long run, David, is changing the way in which we deliver health care in this country.  You know, there have been a whole set of studies done, they look at health care, the frequency of different procedures, whether it's tonsillectomies or hysterectomies in different parts of the country, and what you see is that in some parts of the country procedures are done three times as frequently and there's no benefit in terms of the health of the population. And by doing the right kind of cost-effectiveness, by making the right kinds of investments and protection, some experts that we--estimate that we could take as much as $700 billion a year out of our health care system.  Now, we wouldn't have to do anything like that, we wouldn't have to do a third of that in order to pay for a very aggressive program of increased coverage.  And so really the president and OMB director Orszag have identified a number of items that they call the game changers:  prevention, cost-effectiveness, research, doing a better job on, on reimbursements.  And as we put those into effect we can get this growth of health care costs under control.  And it'll be a good thing for the federal budget and, frankly, a good thing for the national economy.

Is that man still employed? (4.00 / 1)
Damn.

Montani semper liberi
[ Parent ]
Saturday Evening Death Panels Open Thread | 35 comments
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