Climate change bill DOA in the Senate

by: Chris Bowers

Mon Dec 28, 2009 at 15:00


The House passed a climate change bill all the way back in June.  In November, the Senate declared they would take up the bill in the spring.  Now, it appears likely that the Senate will take up the bill never:

Bruised by the health care debate and worried about what 2010 will bring, moderate Senate Democrats are urging the White House to give up now on any effort to pass a cap-and-trade bill next year.

"I am communicating that in every way I know how," said Sen. Mary Landrieu (D-La.), one of at least a half-dozen Democrats who've told the White House or their own leaders that it's time to jettison the centerpiece of their party's plan to curb global warming.(...)

"We need to deal with the phenomena of global warming, but I think it's very difficult in the kind of economic circumstances we have right now," said Indiana Democratic Sen. Evan Bayh, who called passage of any economywide cap and trade "unlikely."

"I'd just as soon see that set aside until we work through the economy," said Sen. Ben Nelson (D-Neb.). "What we don't want to do is have anything get in the way of working to resolve the problems with the economy."

"Climate change in an election year has very poor prospects," added Sen. Kent Conrad (D-N.D.). "I've told that to the leadership."

If 2009 taught us one lesson that can be applied to climate change legislation, it should be that cap and trade is never going to pass through the 60-vote Senate.  This leaves two options:

  1. Get rid of the filibuster
  2. Abandon all attempts at congressional action ASAP, and turn immediately to the Executive Branch
Since #1 isn't going to happen in the short term, that makes #2 the only option for 2010.  Fortunately, earlier in the month, the EPA began to take action:

In Monday's much-anticipated announcement, the Environmental Protection Agency said that six gases, including carbon dioxide and methane, pose a danger to the environment and the health of Americans and that the agency would start drawing up regulations to reduce those emissions.

"These are reasonable, common-sense steps," EPA Administrator Lisa P. Jackson said, adding that they would protect the environment "without placing an undue burden on the businesses that make up the better part of our economy." At the same time, however, EPA regulation is no one's preferred outcome -- not even the EPA's. Jackson said her agency and other administration officials would still prefer if Congress acted before they did.

The Obama administration did not want to go this route, for two reasons.  The first reason was an argument about how a law passed by Congress would be more difficult to overturn than a regulatory process conducted by the EPA.  However, given that an emissions permit market also requires regulation, that was always a pretty flimsy argument.  Further, a poorly regulated emission permit market could actually result in another financial bubble.  As such, it is entirely unconvincing that the legislative route creates less peril under a future administration that refuses to enforce regulations.

The second reason was political: the Obama administration did not want sole responsibility for pushing greenhouse gas regulations.  Well, at this point, nuts to that.  Tough.  With the 60-vote Senate, and the administration's ongoing protection of conservative Democrats, there is no realistic legislative option. The executive branch is going to have to continue doing the heavy lifting itself.

Lester Brown came to our office today and had a nice chat with us Gristers.(...)

One thing from our chat jumped out at me. In the context of a debate about the clean energy bill in Congress (he thinks it's worse than nothing), Brown made the point that there's actually a lot of good carbon policy in the pipeline, which will get us some big gains in the short-term. He cited the boost in fuel efficiency standards from the EPA and DOT; green stimulus spending flowing through DOE and states; EPA's denial of recent coal mining and power plant permits; new federal enforcement of appliance efficiency standards; EPA's new CO2 reporting requirements; and various state-level policies like renewable mandates.

These are indeed good policies! Notice anything they share in common? That's right: they bypass the U.S. Congress.

My gut tells me that we should have killed the climate change bill in the House back in June.  Doing so would have forced the executive branch's hand on the endangerment finding at least four months earlier.  The legislative approach was always a dead-end, and so the executive branch needed to be pushed earlier and harder.

Any further time we spend trying to pass a DOA climate change bill of questionable value through the United States Congress is a waste of resources.  It is time to cut our losses, and focus our efforts on areas where a difference can actually be made.

Chris Bowers :: Climate change bill DOA in the Senate

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Oh it's not dead... not yet... (0.00 / 0)
Just last month Carper was talking about couching a climate bill as part of a jobs bill.  Considering the green economy is about the only way to regrow jobs at home, it makes sense.  It all depends on how much Obama wants it, and my guess right now is not so much. We'll know more after the SOTU address.

REID: Voting against us was never part of our arrangement!
SPECTER: I am altering the deal! Pray I don't alter it any further!
REID: This deal keeps getting worse all the time!


no, that would have to be a more limited (4.00 / 1)
energy bill/green jobs thing. There is no way they are attaching cap and trade to a jobs bill.

Join the Iowa progressive community at Bleeding Heartland.

[ Parent ]
A "w" is a "w" (4.00 / 2)
Cap-and-trade is a global derivatives scheme dreamt up by the pinstripe bandits.

This scheme is supposed to be "policed" by a distant bureaucracy...

Hmmm.

Isn't that, like, the same stuff that always backfires?

Massive spending on the actual infrastructure of the future is a big victory.


[ Parent ]
Ben Nelson (4.00 / 3)
So Ben Nelson wants to "work on the economy."  The last time his stupidness did that, he and Susan Collins managed to bipartisanly take 1 million jobs out of the stimulus bill without much reducing costs.  He's doing the same "magic" to health care.  Ben Nelson has the reverse midas touch.  Every thing he touches turns to ****.  

Given the same old voices (Nelson, Conrad, Landrieu, Bayh) with the same old horrible results. that's the biggest argument that could be made for climate control.

Since Nebraska has little or no tourism, there are three levers against Nelson.  As I keep saying, we can move or close down SAC and the nearly 10,000 jobs it brings to Nebraska.  So move it from low unemployment Nebraska to high unemployment Michigan.  Or close it down as the Russians are no peril.  We can boycott the few Nebraska based companies that do business to consumers outside the state.  That comes down to Cabela's (headquartered in Nebraska) and Mutual of Omaha.

Either way, a million people are unemployed so far because of stupid Ben.  Now he wants to ruin health care and destroy the planet.  What a maroon. (ref to Bugs Bunny, folks)


Yglesias put it (4.00 / 3)
rather nicely some months back: "Nelson: Bad Economy Means We Should Wreck Economy, Destroy Planet, Let Health Care Languish". Like something out of The Onion, really. You don't even need to parody it.

[ Parent ]
More "change you can believe in"? (4.00 / 2)
We are not likely to see anything that obama ran on and we knew this when he made rahm his COS.

If obama meant what he said on campaign trail, he would be calling out reps so that we had a chance to run against them (with support from party and White House).  

Instead, rahm just calls us "F*CKIN' STOOOOOPID" and, he is right if we continue to support this administration.


Vote your conscious (4.00 / 1)
The current WH COS has said that challenging dems is stupid and did use the "F" word to describe it.

Maybe that's a term of endearment where you come from, but it is just plain "fightin' words" everywhere else.

If you think these people are going to do anything progressive and liberal that was part of the campaign, that's up to you - more and more are not buying it.


[ Parent ]
That's a real handy hammer you got. (4.00 / 2)
What with it making everything turn into a nail and all.

[ Parent ]
Nice snark - which part of rahm's use of "F*CKIN' STUPID (4.00 / 1)
Don't you understand?

[ Parent ]
Oh, I'm not a big fan of Rahm Emanuel (4.00 / 3)
But I don't think he's primarily to blame for the Senate having a 60-vote requirement or its unfair and constitutionally-mandated apportionment system or all the corporate money sloshing around the political system to buy off "centrist" senators or all the political cowardice among senators in general or a Republican party that is parodically unwilling to engage with reality, all of which has about a billion times more to do with this post than the fact that Rahm is kind of a jerkwad.

[ Parent ]
And who is responsible for fact that he and obama sit on their hands? (4.00 / 1)
Nothing will change as long as many are willing to make endless excuses, shielding key players from responsibility because they have a "D" after their name.

Fortunately, more and more will not accept this anymore.


[ Parent ]
And credible reports are that obama/rahm are behind the senators (4.00 / 1)
that are being obstructionist anyhow, so well-informed people can question the motives and integrity of the folks that sit back and tell us "gee, nothing can possibly be done".

[ Parent ]
Our Friend Arnie. . .. (4.00 / 1)
Has one or two things to say:

Dems suck.  Don't vote for them.  People are quitting in droves.

Rahm sucks.  Don't support him.

O and:

boycott the military industrial complex

and:

We need to start a third party.

OK, that's four things.  

I've seen a couple dozen so posts in the last week and they are all covered by the points above, though there is usually also some kind of agitated or pained remark directed at adjacent posters.

Of course, I'm a big Dem poser for suggesting that if you've only got four things to say, maybe you only need four posts to say them in.



The everyday people of the whole earth are ready to run the sphere in peace.


[ Parent ]
Have much more to say than that (0.00 / 0)
but homers here are very adept at misrepresenting posts in a vain attempt to help a few diarists rationalize obama/rahm sell-out and rally the troops around their guy (now anti-progressive) in the house.

Dishonestly represent what ever posts you like - more and more people in these threads are coming to the same conclusions - and there are many more than the four you try to flame.


[ Parent ]
So your job here (0.00 / 0)
is to hang out pointing out the inherent "lie" anytime someone (in Openleft, or the media) suggests any kind of collaboration or endorsement of a Democratic politician.

What a cool disruptive hobby.

The everyday people of the whole earth are ready to run the sphere in peace.


[ Parent ]
Same people who've been obstructing health care ... (0.00 / 0)
And other 2009 priorities.  Nelson, Landrieu, Conrad, etc.  How the hell did these people take control of the senate?  Here's to hoping that the filibuster actually does get reformed so we can get to work.  What am I thinking, they'll probably just filibuster that too.

By default - a vacuum of leadership (4.00 / 1)
But, as you say, it is all of the "2009 priorities" - actually all of his promises during the campaign.

They take control by default and with behind-the-scenes support of the party and white house.  

I don't know what the full-story here is, but rahm has made it clear what the White House thinks of "interference" by the little people that got obama into the White House.


[ Parent ]
I am NOT saying it is a senate problem - it is much larger (4.00 / 1)
Reliable reports that White House was behind demise of public option.  The party and the White House certainly did get behind the need to let LIE-berman and blue dogs control the dialog.

I have not seen anyone called out on this nor any leadership for real change from White House - certainly not "yes we can" or "change you can believe in".

Believe what you want - most progressives/liberals that have kept up on the process of reform have seen that the problem is much bigger than the few senators that have stood in the limelight - there are others that stand in the backgound and it appears they are not all in the senate.


[ Parent ]
Enough harping about getting rid of the filibuster. (4.00 / 1)
It's not going to happen, and it shouldn't anyway.  Focusing on that as a solution to GOP obstructionism is nothing but an excuse for laziness.  We should be focusing on ridding the Senate of conservative Democrats as well as Republicans.

The refusal to pass bad legislation, which this cap-and-trade farce most certainly is -- just read an issue or three of your average scientific magazine, like Scientific American, or even the Los Angeles Times for example -- presents the left with an opportunity to pass something better.  If the health scare debacle is proof of anything, it's that we should be wasting valuable time trying to pass something that will appease the conservatives.  Start out with something good, like a pollution tax, and get those investments in clean energy, agricultural practices reform (like switching to no-till farming and breaking up the mega-farms), stuff like that.  Maybe the final bill won't resemble what we ultimately want, but it will be infinitely better than starting out with something weak and ending up with a harmful bill.

"Given the choice between a Republican and someone who acts like a Republican, people will vote for the real Republican all the time." -- Harry S. Truman


Correction: (0.00 / 0)
This:

If the health scare debacle is proof of anything, it's that we should be wasting valuable time trying to pass something that will appease the conservatives.

Should read like this:

If the health scare debacle is proof of anything, it's that we shouldn't be wasting valuable time trying to pass something that will appease the conservatives.


"Given the choice between a Republican and someone who acts like a Republican, people will vote for the real Republican all the time." -- Harry S. Truman

[ Parent ]
How does this idea apply? (4.00 / 4)
You see in front of you an example of how some members of congress are unwilling to even confront an issue.  Submitting legislation that is even further to the left isn't going to magically fix that issue.



[ Parent ]
It's basic strategy. (4.00 / 1)
When was the last time you saw Republicans push for anything less than 100% of what they want?  When was the last time they ever started out with something weaker than what they want, for fear that the bill(s) would never get Democratic support otherwise, and then bargain down from there?  I can't recall any time in the past three decades.  You go to the table demanding everything you want, or more, and then get the other side to compromise as much or more than you do.  Then you end up with something everybody can live with.  Start out talks already having given away the store, and signaling your willingness to give up even more, and naturally the other side will see no reason to bargain -- not when they know all they have to do is hold firm and then follow up with an offensive.

"Given the choice between a Republican and someone who acts like a Republican, people will vote for the real Republican all the time." -- Harry S. Truman

[ Parent ]
DOA (4.00 / 3)
And how does this basic strategy apply to this post, where even the watered down version is DOA?

I agree we need to push the Overton window.  Asking for more is an important step in that process.  But it is just one step that needs to be understood in context; it is no magical pony.  In this case, it is of no use at all.

In this case, the correct solution is (would have been) for Obama to agree to an international policy that meets the 350 requirement and ordered the EPA to regulate accordingly.  That would motivate the Senate to put in something that moderates that action, but we might agree to because it would be deemed more effective and efficient.

But no good negotiator starts the bid zero or 100x what the other will pay.  You start low (or high), but within almost reason.

And no, Republicans do not ask for everything their furthest right base looks for.  Not even close.  Abortion is still legal.  Christianity is not the official religion.  Medicare and Social Security still exist...


[ Parent ]
It's based on reality. (0.00 / 0)
The other side is not interested in making deals, only getting its way 100% of the time.  Therefore, the notion that we should go into discussion with half-loaves and bargaining down from there is nonsense.  It's an excuse for caving in from the start.  And if you think the GOP doesn't start off demanding everything it wants and finishes by getting as close to it as it can, you haven't been living in America.  Just look at what they managed to do on abortion.  They haven't gotten Roe v. Wade overturned, but they got Obama and the Democrats to restrict access to abortion at every turn they could, from cutting off federal funding to organizations that provide it to writing up legislation that forbids even private insurance plans from paying for it.  Or did you not read the Stupak amendment?

"Given the choice between a Republican and someone who acts like a Republican, people will vote for the real Republican all the time." -- Harry S. Truman

[ Parent ]
The drive to reform the filibuster is growing in power and momentum. (4.00 / 4)
The right of a Democracy to govern is coming clearer. Obama's grumblings show the centre is more than interested, the screaming horrible mess of health insurance reform has stiffened some spines, and allowed people to understand where the blockade to good government is. It is in the Senate, it is the anti-democratic formulations that give undo power to the Senators from Aetna and Monsanto and Exxon.

The framers had no filibuster, the constitution has no filibuster, the writers of the filibuster procedural rule applied it to prevent Bills passing in a blink, it was intended to allow a delay of a few days before a bill could be passed, so that communication and consideration was possible before voting. This is the way it was used until this century, until these last two decades.

It is time for reform, time for democracy, time for the people to be listened to: time for government of the people, by the people, so that government will be for the people.

Change
"We must break up the banks and never again let them get so big that they distort our politics and take down the economy.


Seems like the lazy way out. (0.00 / 0)
Suppose you get your way and the filibuster is removed or further crippled.  What do we do when the Rethugs retake the Senate?  I'm not willing to force Democrats to shoot themselves in the foot just because the left is too lazy to make the bad members in the Senate do their jobs.

"Given the choice between a Republican and someone who acts like a Republican, people will vote for the real Republican all the time." -- Harry S. Truman

[ Parent ]
60 votes is just wrong (4.00 / 1)
It's only been abused for a few years.  But now that cloture abuse is standard procedure, it will never "just fix itself".

Shit needs to happen sometimes.  It should not take 60+ Senators to pass legislation.

The everyday people of the whole earth are ready to run the sphere in peace.


[ Parent ]
But why eliminate it? (0.00 / 0)
Changing the makeup of the Senate in favor of actual progressives is what's called for.  I just don't think getting rid of the filibuster is a constructive solution.

"Given the choice between a Republican and someone who acts like a Republican, people will vote for the real Republican all the time." -- Harry S. Truman

[ Parent ]
Democrcy is a right, our parents died for it. (0.00 / 0)
Democracy is what the majority of the people want.
It is what gives legitimacy, credence and authority to government.

It is why we stopped the Nazi war machine. It is why we passed the Civil rights act. It is why your parents gave up their lives.

Giving some people greater power than other citizens is anethema, is anti-American is anti democratic.


Change
"We must break up the banks and never again let them get so big that they distort our politics and take down the economy.


[ Parent ]
Agreed. (0.00 / 0)
So why do you want to remove another piece of it?  The filibuster isn't perfect, and it has been abused in the past, but that doesn't make it part of the problem.

"Given the choice between a Republican and someone who acts like a Republican, people will vote for the real Republican all the time." -- Harry S. Truman

[ Parent ]
you read my mind (4.00 / 2)
I have been ready to pull the plug on the climate change bill for a while now. Since reading this piece I've had a follow-up post in my head about how we need to give up trying to pass cap and trade in the Senate. It is a waste of everyone's energy, and the House bill wasn't worth passing anyway.

Join the Iowa progressive community at Bleeding Heartland.

Concentrate on the military/national security aspects of deficit reduction (4.00 / 1)
Perhaps the left should take on the pretense of deficit hawks for the purpose of choking down the money spent on Iraq and Afghanistan.  This requires a shift in framing from the morality and effectiveness of the war to the pure cost-effectiveness of the war.

This seems to be the direction that the Obama administration and Senate centrists might take in 2010, so it seems like a good move to co-opt the language and re-aim it towards progressive ends.  If progressive social spending is mostly blocked, perhaps the lesser goal of cutting non-progressive government spending can be achieved.

Furthermore, being annoying about military spending may be the best way to get rid of the filibuster.  The Senate adopted a cloture rule at Woodrow Wilson's insistence due to Bob La Follette's filibustering of legislation that would have allowed merchant ships to arm themselves before US entry into WWI.  The cloture threshold was lowered to 60 in the 1970s in part due to liberals being annoying in their use of the filibuster in opposition to the Vietnam War.  If the left can create enough numbers to use the filibuster to block some war spending that is wanted by a majority of the Senate, that may be the key to a bipartisan coalition for removing the filibuster.


Things You Don't Talk About in Polite Company: Religion, Politics, the Occasional Intersection of Both


Don't blame the filibuster (4.00 / 1)
cap-and-trade is unpopular.

not according to recent polling (4.00 / 1)
In fact, most view it as a job creator

REID: Voting against us was never part of our arrangement!
SPECTER: I am altering the deal! Pray I don't alter it any further!
REID: This deal keeps getting worse all the time!


[ Parent ]
Exactly - intentionally or unintentionally it is a problem (4.00 / 2)
when self-proclaimed progressives/liberals "catapult the propoganda" that the mainstream media uses to create the lie that America is a "center to right" nation.

And the lie that we are a "center to left" nation is really just based on redefining the middle ground so it actually means the same as "center to right".  


[ Parent ]
Like, who are you arguing with? (4.00 / 1)
Who are the self-proclaimers?

And, so you are saying both "center right" and "center left" are lies?

Hmmm.

Like, are you one of these people that gets paid to hang out in Progressive chat rooms posting confusing Anti-Dem statements?

It's cool if you are not.  I'm just saying, you've got a knack for it.  Might be a good career move for you.. . .  

The everyday people of the whole earth are ready to run the sphere in peace.


[ Parent ]
I'm not sure that this is true (0.00 / 0)
The polling I've seen shows that most Americans think clean energy is a job creator, but that a "cap-and-trade" approach is the least popular approach. Carbon taxes, for example, poll better than "cap-and-trade." The idea of giving corporate polluters permits to keep polluting, and letting them trade the permits, and then letting Wall Street traders slice and dice them and mix in offsets and other schemes and loopholes sounds crazy to most Americans. I can understand why. Maybe if the Democrats had a bill that wasn't written by Wall Street traders, it'd be more politically salable.


[ Parent ]
Cap and trade is a terrible solution anyway. (4.00 / 6)
We shouldn't let the left get mixed up with cap and trade as it is most certainly a  right wing, market oriented solution. Imagine if conservatives proposed that we prepare for going into WWII by creating a new speculative market scheme that we hoped would get us fully armed in time...

We can't let hijacked neoliberal solutions define the progressive approach to climate change.

Agitate.Liberate.Create.


Agreed--and James Hansen backs us up (4.00 / 2)
He's no wild-eyed progressive--just a scientist who understands better than just about anybody the scope and urgency of the problem.  He called the Kerry-Graham framework worse than nothing, if I remember correctly; and said it would be a wholly inadequate "Ponzi scheme" which would allow Congress to declare victory while not even remotely addressing the problem.

"Storms of My Grandchildren" convinced me completely that the legislative process in the U.S. will not even begin to address the burgeoning climate catastrophe until it is far too late, if then.  EPA's use of its regulatory authority under the CAA as reaffirmed by the US Supreme Court is our last best hope for action.  Massachusetts v. EPA may turn out to be one of the most important decisions of the last half century.


[ Parent ]
Nope - dur chimpfurher's super-rich "base" doesn't need to (4.00 / 1)
do anything about this catastrophe.  They can build climate controlled geo-bubbles for themselves on earth and colonies on the moon and beyond.  This all just becomes an efficient way to eliminate useless eaters. /snark

[ Parent ]
Woohoo! Right On! (0.00 / 0)
"Green Mars," here we come!

[ Parent ]
I think (4.00 / 1)
That parts of the right have little care about the long tern because they believe that the rapture will evacuate them from the consequences of their mistakes.

Big gamble if you ask me.


[ Parent ]
Chimpfuhrer? (0.00 / 0)


The everyday people of the whole earth are ready to run the sphere in peace.

[ Parent ]
Exactly. (4.00 / 1)
Its not even a "progressive" approach. Its interesting to picture how this debate will be framed when the US actually starts to take measures. (thats a big if) Republicans will start having a hissy fit calling Obama and command and control eco-dictator if it comes down to EPA mandates. Meanwhile, if you asked them what branch should be implementing disaster preparedness measures they will probably start yelling about FEMA concentration camps...

At any rate, it seems pretty damn unlikely that any of the developed countries are going to do anything that the science necessitates to reduce emissions substantially... soo... I'm ready when you all are ;)

Agitate.Liberate.Create.


Obama administration's existing authority is key (4.00 / 1)
Thanks for identifying the executive branch as the best domestic location for progress on climate change in the near term.

The current Senate isn't going to pass anything that resembles good policy. Fortunately, the Clean Air Act already provides important tools that can reduce greenhouse gas emissions. You can find a good overview of those tools here: http://www.biologicaldiversity...


Unless Congress eliminates the EPA's power to regulate CO2 emissions (0.00 / 0)
which is a feature in some of the climate change legislation that has been discussed. Should we be whipping the Senate to make sure there are forty votes against any legislation that would limit the EPA's power to regulate carbon dioxide? As long as the filibuster is here, we might as well use it.

[ Parent ]





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