Rear View--NOT How We Messed Up

by: Paul Rosenberg

Sat Jul 14, 2007 at 14:25


(This is a great response to Mike Lux's discussion of how Democrats lost our way in the 1970s. - promoted by Matt Stoller)

On Thursday, Mike Lux posted an excellent diary, "How We Messed Up".  As Mike explained:
When I blogged on the launching of OpenLeft on Huffington Post, mentioning that I was an insider joining two great bloggers in Matt and Chris, a reader who was perhaps a bit of a smartass mentioned that since us insiders had screwed things up so badly, maybe I could write about how we had pulled that off.

That actually inspired me to dig up something I wrote a couple of years ago, never published but shared with friends, regarding my thinking about how and why Democratic insiders had messed things up starting back about 35-40 years ago.

This piece doesn't explain everything about how the conservative movement succeeded and ours failed over the last two generations.

While Mike's analysis is deserving of serious study, the last sentence is what I want to focus on.  You see, while Mike's attitude is refreshing coming from an insider, his analysis still reflects an insider's-view bias.

The perspective I'd like to present is not to get the insiders off the hook (I'm a lifelong outsider, myself), but to talk about the larger social/cultural context.  My argument is that all the problems Mike identified stemmed in part from the failure to do this adequately in the first place.  Which is why I don't want to see us repeat that mistake.

In addition, Mike's analysis suffers from a subtle rear-view-mirror distortion. It's a more subtle version of what conservatives often do in creating a fantasy version of the 1950s creating an imaginary collective subject that never actually existed.  For progressives, the 1960s and  '70s were very much about creating a new pluralistic progressive subject.  It's ahistorical to fault that subject for not doing something before it actually formed.

Paul Rosenberg :: Rear View--NOT How We Messed Up
To begin with, Mike's intro continues:
It doesn't address the pacifying and trivializing effect of TV on politics, for example, or the white working class reaction to the changes society was going through. But I think it does give some interesting thoughts on what went wrong.
Anyone who lived through the 1960s can tell you that TV by itself does not have a pacifying and trivializing effect on politics.  But I know what Mike was talking about.  And precisely because it wasn't the technology per se, it's a good idea not to go down that path here.

But the white working class is something else.  There can really be little doubt that the conservative movement is based largely on resentment, and the key resentment it is based on is racial--even to this day. That's reason #1, 2 and 3 that the South is solid Republican at the presidential level, while it used to be Democratic.  And without the Solid South, we'd be in the final 2 years of the Gore Administration.  (Don't worry, Joementum would still be a terrible campaigner. No way he'd be elected President in 2008.)

Anti-feminism and homophobia play a much more overt role these days, for the simple reason that old-style overt racism is no longer socially acceptable.  But one look at the electoral map reminds us of where the bedrock of resentment politics lies.

The first part of Mike's analysis can be encapsulated thus:

The assumptions of taking for granted that you are a majority

As a result of 40 years of policy and electoral success, Democrats became complacent in a number of ways:

• Becoming defenders of the status quo.
• Intellectual laziness. 
• Protecting incumbents was more important than building the farm team or shaking things up.
• [Not] Building for the long term.
• No urgency about institution building or ideological coherency.

All this is true. But there's more.  Here's a few of the most salient additional points that need consideration:

(1) Limits of the American Welfare State.  For all the accopmlishments that Mike cited in his post (Social Security, labor law reform, progressive taxation, backing and financial services regulation, the GI Bill the Marshall Plan, civil rights legislation, Medicare, Medicaid, OSHA, and EPA), America has the smallest and most fragmented welfare state of the advanced industrial nations.

We still lack universal health care--which Germany introduced back in the 1880s.  So "behind the curve" is putting it mildly.  But we also lack any sort of family support--paid family leave, paid childcare, etc.  We also have much more dependence on means-tested programs than other countries. The bottom line on this is the old saw, "Programs for poor people tend to be poor programs."  In the name of being less expensive, they end up costing a lot more to administer, and they breed considerable resentment.  Finally, programs are administered by federal, state and local government, creating additional fragmentation and disparities.

In short, the accomplishments, while considerable in an American context, left much to be desired objectively.  Failure to recognize this was part of what contributed to both the complacency Mike wrote about, and to an ongoing conflict between insiders and grassroots activists.

(2) Limits of American Liberalism's Governing Power.  In terms of new legislation, The New Deal ended in 1938.  From then until 1965, a combination of Republicans and Southern Democrats (known as the conservative coalition) prevented any major new liberal legislation from being passed.  The sole exception was the 1964 Civil Rights Act, which had support from liberal and moderate Republicans.  Democrats only had two years of a solid liberal majority in which to pass the most progressive Great Society legislation.  This relatively limited window of a clear liberal majority in Congress is directly related to the limited and fragmentary welfare state, as well as to the fragmentary nature of other liberal accopmlishments, such as environmental protection.

(3) The Weakness of American Labor.  America is the only advanced industrial country never to have had a leftwing party in its national legislature.  In international terms, the Democratic Party is a centrist party.  Leftwing parties are traditionally parties of labor. But in America, labor has never had a party of its own that has served in Congress.  Within the Democratic Party, labor's power has always been relatively subordinate.  The regressive aspects of the Taft-Hartley Act--passed over Truman's veto--were never repealed by the Democrats in subsequent years, even when they had commanding majorities, as they did most prominently in 1965-66.  While labor was able to enjoy a long legacy of its peak of strength from the late 1930s through the 1960s, it did not consistently advance it's own distinct agenda in the political realm, nor did it continue expanding its organizing efforts to raise, or even maintain the level of workplace unionization.

(4) The Impact of Post-Materialism.  Attaining a certain level of affluence has the effect of producing a change in value-orientation that has been observed world-wide in data collect by the World Values Survey [wikipedia entry].  Researcher Robert Inglehard has been the leading theorist connecting this data to Maslow's hierarchy of needs. Generations raised in a condition of material affluence tend to prioritize individual improvement, personal freedom, participation in government decisionmaking, and environmental protection.  Sound like the 1960s?  You betcha!  And the '60s were a worldwide phenomena--at least among the more affluent countries.

The combined effect of 1, 2 and 3, however, meant that in America, post-materialist values were more likely to be expressed in ways that brought them into conflict with materialist heritage of previous liberalism that had made the emergence of post-materialism possible.  Thus, for example, post-materialism in a strongly-unionized culture would tend toward expression in terms of increased rank-and-file activism, more democratic decsion-making, etc., while post-materialism in a weakly-unionized culture would often be expressed in hostiity, or at least indifference, to unions per se.

In America, the coming of post-materialism in the mainstream white culture coincided with the culmination of the Civil Rights Movement and the subsequent rise of Black Power.  Without a strong progressive instutional framework to support it, the white middle class was particularly ripe for reactionary appeals.

Summing Up

The list above is merely exemplary of a few factors that need to be considered.  I haven't even touched on the different factors that have created a strong tension between insider and grassroots progressives.  But what I hope these points can serve to do is highlight the fact that insider progressives were never in such a secure and unified state to begin with.  And Democrats (hardly the same things) were perhaps more secure, but certainly no more unified.

Why does any of this matter?  Good question.  The lessons that Mike drew are certainly valid in a striaght-forward operational sense.  But if what I'm saying is true, then three things follow:

(A) The lessons are necessary, but not sufficient.  Of course, Mike never said otherwise, so I'm not criticizing him. Rather, I'm addressing a dynamic.  Insider resistence to change is massive.  The needed change Mike points to is real.  But if it's considered in isolation two dangers arise: (1) Among those advocating change, the tendency to treat the lessons as panaceas, forgetting the other work that needs to be done. (2) Among those resisting change, the use of other factors to discredit the importance of the lessons Mike points to.

(B) The lessons need to be understood in terms of the times (past, from which they are drawn), and applied in terms of the times (present and future,  when they will be implemented).  One of the persistent problems of insider politics is the focus on what's legislatable.  This focus is absolutely vital in order to get anything done.  But it often leads to myopia with respect to the larger historical and institutional contexts in which politics plays out.  I am not suggesting that there is a short list of outside factors that need to be added to the above analysis.  Rather, I am suggesting that we need to think about structuring an openness to continual input about these larger contexts which may not have any immediate legislative consequences.

(C) The problem was not simply what insiders did wrong, or failed to do right. It was the very nature of how inside and outside were constructed.

Conservatives and progressives have very different ideas about how they should be constructed, and progressive ideas are both more dynamic and more varied as well. Hence, conservatives can work from common frameworks under top-down centralized control much more readily than progresives can.  We cannot simply copy them. Rather, we need to find our own ways, consistent with our values, to do the things that conservatives do, while doing other things as well.

In particular, we need to synergize the building of effective political strucutres with systemic openness--to people, information and ideas.  We need structures that are highly permeable, so that they are maximally responsive to the larger environment, to the grassroots as well as the larger historical forces and factors that such as those I touched on above.  And so that people can become insiders more easily, and then step back outside again.

If all this seems a bit vague, if tantalizing, then good.  I don't pretend to have the answers.  I just want to extend the conversation.


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Three other factors: (0.00 / 0)
First, lots of people don't vote.  When half your electorate stays home, the results are badly skewed.

Second, the American citizenry changed in some very significant ways.  One of them is headcount.  1930 census was 123.2 million; 1940 was 132.2 million; 1950 was 150.5 million; 1960 was 179.3 million; 1970 was 203.3 million, 1980 was 226.5 million; 1990 was 248.7 million; and 2000 was 281.4 million.  This 2.28 growth, more than doubling the population of the US, included demographic changes that seem to be ignored by the Democratic Party.

Third, the cost of campaigning went up, astronomically.


Good Points, But... (4.00 / 1)
(1) The shrinking electorate is partly related to the lack of a labor party.  Voting drops off heavily as income goes down.  A party that represented the working class would counter that significantly.

(2) You'll have to clarify your demographic argument.  The population increase has factors that both helped Democrats and ones that did not.

(3) Absolutely!  Not only did the cost go up, but the orientation was increasingly away from substance, and substance favors the Dems.

The common factor in my response to all three of your points is that all the trends we're likely to point to work in tandem with other factors.  So spotting trends should be the starting point of our analysis.

"You know what they say -- those of us who fail history... doomed to repeat it in summer school." -- Buffy The Vampire Slayer, Season 6, Episode 3


[ Parent ]
Agreed. (0.00 / 0)
My comments were on the order of these changes took place & the Democratic Party, largely, ignored them.

[ Parent ]
Great commentary (4.00 / 1)
Paul, I truly love this commentary, really smart and thoughtful, agree with much of it. This is exactly the kind of analysis I was hoping to provoke. After I get the chance to digest what you wrote, and read other reactions, I'll try to respond more in depth, but in the meantime, bravo...

What a collaborative environment we're fostering here! (0.00 / 0)
One might say we were 'open'...

Kicking it in the NY-25.

[ Parent ]
The US as a pre-postindustrialist nation (4.00 / 4)
Paul,

I think that all the points you make are valid. I also agree that the Democratic party as it currently exists is more centrist than almost anyone is prepared to admit. In other words, we presently live under a one party, two-faction government. That is why all the seeming desire on the part of America's citizens to see major changes in healthcare and education are never reflected in Congressional legislation no matter which faction is in charge. I believe that even with a Democratic supermajority in Congress and a Democratic president, we would not see the kinds of legislative changes that the majority of Americans want. To me, the key quote from your post is this:

For progressives, the 1960s and '70s were very much about creating a new pluralistic progressive subject.  It's ahistorical to fault that subject for not doing something before it actually formed.

I read Kagan's "Of Paradise and Power" when it first came out. His argument that it was the crude military and global economic (the dollar) shelter of America's might that allowed civilized Europe to maintain its "postmodern paradise" never sat well with me. I didn't buy it then. I don't buy it now.

Something else I don't buy is the similar argument that it is America's corporate capitalist umbrella that provides the shelter necessary for American society to function. The interests of working middle-class America (lower, middle and upper middle class) are almost entirely absent from the decisions of our government. If it were not so, we would be living in an entirely different society than the one we currently inhabit.

The idea that the turn to the right in the 70s was an unavoidable result of the Civil Rights movement never sat well with me. I didn't buy it then. I don't buy it now. It is not only about how we messed up. We are still messing up. The Democratic party, in and out of power, is no real friend to the middle class. The Democratic party lost its way years ago.

A postindustrial society is an educated, physically healthy and cultured society in which basic opportunities are available to everyone. As you point out, that means that a postindustrial society is also a post-materialistic society. Post-materialistic does not mean regressive in terms of technology and economy. America, for all its productivity and prosperity, is increasingly regressive in its technology and is failing in its ability to compete in the global economy as a result.

I do not know if the Democratic party has the will or the ability to change itself enough to lead the US into the ranks of the most civilized nations in the world. And I do not think, given our present electoral system, that a third party is an option. That being said, for there to be any possibility for real change in the American society, the Democratic party will have to adapt itself to a working middle-class political agenda and a corresponding commitment to change that is far to the "left" of its present course.


a question (0.00 / 0)
What do you mean by "regressive in its technology?"  (I have some guesses, but I'm not sure... )

New Jersey politics at Blue Jersey.

[ Parent ]
Regressive in technology (4.00 / 3)
By regressive in its technology I mean several things. One is the lack of government support for pure research. Another is the failure of education to prepare students to compete in global technology markets. A third is the anti-competitive and monopoly capitalistic regulation (and de-regulation) that has led to stagnation in key markets.

The US has historically maintained large technology leads over competitor nations. The failure of the US to maintain its competitive advantage is evident in the failure of key IP (i.e, intellectual property) economies such as biomed, pharma, communications, energy and transportation. These and other critical technology segments are now beginning to slow and in some cases to trail behind competitor nations.

Wealth transfer and capital creation using military and financial means will only get you so far. In the 21st century it is a strategy for societal failure. As a country we are witnessing that right now.

Ultimately, it is technology in all its forms that drives  market capitalism through the creation of new and more efficient markets with their associated products and services.


[ Parent ]
thanks (0.00 / 0)
great point.

New Jersey politics at Blue Jersey.

[ Parent ]
A Lot To Thnk About... (4.00 / 2)
But I'll try to tie a few strands together here.

I don't think we live in a one-party system. It's just that the two parties we do have don't represent a very broad span of the political spectrum.  One way to see this is to look at some long-term polling data from the General Social Survey.  Here's a chart that shows levels of support for welfare state spending from 1984 to 2004, combining Social Security, welfare, "improving [the] nation's education system," "improving & protecting [the] environment," "improving & protecting [the] nations health," "improving the conditions of blacks," and "solving problems of big cities."

People self-identify on a 7-point scale. Extreme liberals on the left, extreme conservatives on the right. The number of extreme conservatives who thought we were spending too little on one or more programs (net: i.e. "too little" on two, but "too much" on one is a net of "too little" on one) was nearly twice the number of those who thought we were spending too much: 59.3% to 30.7%.

Obviously, then, even extreme conservatives--roughly 3% of the populaiton, are to the left of the GOP, which is actively committed to cutting the welfare state.  Given that the Democrats have passively let this happen--though, of course, some have fought against it tooth and nail--one can hardly claim that Dems are solidly to the left of extreme conservatives on the issue of welfare state spending, which certainly ought to be a core political concern.

I would say that reconnecting our politics to this sort of fundamental economic reality would go a long way to addressing the bulk of the concerns that you raise.  This certainly won't come from the Democrat's Beltway establishment, especially given the influence of K-Street and the costs of campaigns.  We aren't without allies there.  It's just that they can't possibly be the vanguard in getting us refocused on this sort of fundamental reality.  Thus, I don't think the Democratic Party is hopeless in terms of regaining the necessary focus.  But it will be a helluva struggle.

p.s. It's possible that a key factor in refocusing the party will be struggles over realistic ways to solve major problems in tandem, of the sort such as the Apollo Alliance.

"You know what they say -- those of us who fail history... doomed to repeat it in summer school." -- Buffy The Vampire Slayer, Season 6, Episode 3


[ Parent ]
Isn't Marketing Itself Ultimately The Underlying Cancer? (0.00 / 0)
EVERY problem I come across at one point or another has its roots in marketing, but it seems we can't do anything about it since it's "bad for business". 

Democrats and Progressives, if they have made ANY mistake, it's that they have NOT succumbed to the faith in marketing that the GOP and Conservatives have: Lie, cheat and steal to close the deal and make the sale.


[ Parent ]
Yes And No (0.00 / 0)
I agree with the point you're trying to make, but not with how you're making it. (Poor marketing!)

Marketing doesn't have to involve lying.  And the belief that it does is one reason that progressives haven't done better at it.

Cheating and stealing aren't part of marketing at all.  They're just all part of the same package of how Republicans and movement conservatives move their agenda.

"You know what they say -- those of us who fail history... doomed to repeat it in summer school." -- Buffy The Vampire Slayer, Season 6, Episode 3


[ Parent ]
Let me rephrase that... (0.00 / 0)
Isn't the success the Right has had with what you call "poor marketing" the root of many of our problems? 

What better illustration of this than selling Bush as the "guy you could have a beer with" when he's a dry drunk?  Just a moment of reflection on this sales pitch reveals how hollow it is.  After all, what conversation isn't well oiled by a few drinks?

Kerry and Gore might have been stiffs, but they got sold down the river by the Right marketing them as such.

How do you define poor marketing?  Does the progressive movement need to adopt unethical marketing strategy (as the Right and GOP have) to be successful?


[ Parent ]
Good job Paul (4.00 / 7)
I'd add that many who were progressive in the '60s and early '70s were coopted by materialsim and high-concept consumerism in the '80s and beyond.  There is a real strain of elitism in the insider culture, and a real insularity.  A real divorce from the concerns of ordinary people and a fondness for Wall Street.

Meanwhile, we have seen the decline of incomes, the coming debacle of mortgage resets, oil price shocks, staggering personal debt levels, crumbling educational systems and overarching all, the fear of medical expenses wiping everything out.  The people who run Congress and the Dem party don't experience these things and don't really understand what life is like for most people.  They are in the top 5% if not the top 1% themselves.  They think a high stock market means everything is fine economically.

The Dem Party has to offer a vision to working people that is bold not Clintonian incrementalism.  Restore the safety net!  Regulate the lending industry!  Bring universal health care!  Better education!  Fairer taxation!  The Dems should have been lining up to make hedge fund managers pay ordinary income tax rates on their management fees, not capital gains rates.  It's a no-brainer.  The many versus the few.  But too many of them go for the money every time.

So the problem is that the job wasn't finfished, too many people sold out on the way, and they came to think too small (except for themselves).  The common good needs to be resurrected, and along with it a vibrant public sphere.

John McCain--He's not who you think he is.


I Was Going To Respond But... (4.00 / 1)
by the time I came to the end of your comment, all I wanted to do was clap!

"You know what they say -- those of us who fail history... doomed to repeat it in summer school." -- Buffy The Vampire Slayer, Season 6, Episode 3

[ Parent ]
Some were coopted (4.00 / 2)
But many of those folks who entered politics in the 1980s had never been all that progressive to begin with. It made it easier for them to embrace the corporate system, and that embrace is at the core of the Democrats' political problem. Those folks leveraged their power to beat back the New Left legacy in the '80s and '90s, whether they'd sold out or had been opposed to the New Left all along.

And that gets to the heart of your excellent comment - we need to build a Democratic Party that will not be deluded that corporate America wants them to succeed, and instead build one that wants Americans themselves to succeed.


[ Parent ]
Chris, Matt you need to add Paul here to (4.00 / 5)
your regular front page writing crew! If Paul won't come willingly then you need to drag him in kicking and screaming by whatever means necessary.

He will being historical balance and perspective to OpenLeft.

Jeff Wegerson


Who messed up? (4.00 / 6)
Mike Lux speaks of "we" but I think it is worth questioning who is meant by that. As you so rightly note here, Paul, the New Left did achieve a great deal given these limits laid down between 1938 and 1948, particularly on the welfare state and liberalism more generally.

The New Left was, considered broadly (as it should be), an effort to bring a movement for economic equality and political empowerment that had been around in the US for a hundred years in line with the "post-industrial" social and cultural attitudes of the USA in the years after 1950. The fundamental circumstances had changed dramatically between 1935 and 1965 and the New Left movements rightly understood this and adapted to it.

And they had a fantastic degree of success. By the early 1970s they had punched massive holes in endemic racism, in aspects of American life from culture to the family to labor unions. True democracy was spreading around the country and empowering millions. By 1975 African Americans, to take one example, had won significant political gains in the nation's cities. The Democratic Party had even begun to reform its practices, spearheaded by McGovern after 1968, to be more representative and more inclusive, after insiderdom proved a disaster in Chicago.

But just at the moment of success, the basic conditions of American life underwent a dramatic change. 1970 was the end of the postwar economic boom and within 5 years the nation was mired in stagflation. This hurt the New Left quite badly, as Americans were more willing to countenance fundamental change when they were enjoying prosperity. When jobs and wealth are becoming scarcer, it's easier for scapegoating, racial animus, and conservative ideas to gain just enough support to block further reforms.

The New Left was stymied by this and never quite figured out a solution. All their organizing strategies and many of their ideological goals were predicated on a sharing of the postwar prosperity. Many of them wanted radical changes in how that wealth was to be created and distributed, a longshot in any event and almost impossible in the "crisis" of the 1970s (which doesn't look so bad in comparison to our present moment). With their long term goals seemingly impossible, and their immediate demands now falling on the deaf ears of a white voting public that didn't feel they had room to move, the New Left hit a wall, their agenda incomplete.

But that wasn't the New Left's failure. And Mike Lux wasn't really speaking of that failure. The failure he describes is of the Democratic Party, and their unwillingness - and I use that term deliberately - to absorb the New Left more fully, to challenge the neoliberalism that emerged from the 1970s, to ultimately do something about their minority status.

One key moment was the late 1970s. Faced with a stagnant economy, and complete political power, the Dems had two choices: 1) continue with the reforms launched earlier in the '60s and '70s, embrace liberalism and try to orient it to face this new problem, or 2) retrench, defend the status quo, and fall back on 1950s ideas to try and retain political power. They chose the latter course, embracing a fiscal strategy of tax cuts and military spending in 1978 (two years before Reagan was elected), and seemingly shutting firm the door on further reforms. The doors of power were now closed to the reformers.

During the 1980s, the Dems had only been out of the White House for a few years, and it seemed reasonable that once the charismatic Reagan was termed out, the White House would be theirs again. Surely this is the "natural right to rule" thinking Lux describes but as Dems controlled Congress and as Reagan's policies remained unpopular is wasn't so far fetched. Dukakis DID lead the polls in the summer of '88, after all.

The problem was that Dems thought they had to become like Reagan in order to beat his party, and the results of 1988 seemed to merely confirm that judgment - even though the New Left legacy was still a very potent political force. To me, 1988-92 is the second key moment, where they compounded their 1978 decision and chose to make a full embrace of neoliberal policies, while at the same time attacking fully the legacy of the New Deal. Clinton won a presidential election, but it came at an enormous cost - the end of the political viability of what remained of the New Left, and Democratic acceptance of a program of political economy that was going to screw over much of the Dems' base, from labor to social liberals to women and people of color.

By 2001 it was easy for these Dems to embrace the Bush Administration - they had been telling themselves already that their victories in the '90s had come because they had played Reagan's game successfully, so that if they could play Bush's game they'd win out as well. It was - and continues to be - the ultimate culmination of a massive, world historical failure. Dems thought that neoliberalism and a revival of Cold War foreign policy ideas would save their bacon, and that the New Left, instead of offering a long-term answer, was instead an unwanted millstone.

Here in 2007 we see that the Dems had made the wrong choice, and it has nearly killed this country.


Excellent Points! (4.00 / 5)
I know I've succeeded in furthering the discussing when I get a comment like this. Several days ago, Chris remarked that my comments were like diaries, and I can only say the same here.

To add some detail, in 1978 the Democrats had a sort of mini-convention, focused primarily on platform development, agenda-setting and networking, since there was no presidential politics to do.  The results were significantly progressive, and Michael Harrington, of the Democratic Socialists of America, played a very significant role in networking and organizing alignments of unions and other progressive forces.  Carter's forces saw it as a significant challenge, and removed the authorization for it to ever happen again.  A good deal of initiative came out of that meeting for Ted Kennedy's challenge to Carter in 1980. Unfortunately, Carter's popularity held up in the polls remarkably well until after the primary season was over.

A decade later, Dukakis, though a liberal, did not run as one.  His mantra about the campaign was "It's about competence, not ideology."  While his loss most certainly was interpreted as a repudiation of liberalism, it was actually nothing of the sort.

This was most vividly illustrated in Ohio, when Howard Metzenbaum was a top-tier GOP target.  Metzenbaum ran an aggressive economic populist campaign and won by 14 points, at the same time Dukakis lost Ohio by 11. That was the difference between running as a liberal vs. running away from being a liberal.

It's my belief that Bush fiasco has opened up a tremendous opportunity to push politics significantly back to the left.  But it won't come from the Democratic leadership.  History is very clear on this.

"You know what they say -- those of us who fail history... doomed to repeat it in summer school." -- Buffy The Vampire Slayer, Season 6, Episode 3


[ Parent ]
Don't leave me hanging, my man (0.00 / 0)
Please do explain.  I'm interested:

It's my belief that Bush fiasco has opened up a tremendous opportunity to push politics significantly back to the left.  But it won't come from the Democratic leadership.  History is very clear on this.


Kicking it in the NY-25.

[ Parent ]
I'm Not Sure What Needs Explaining... (4.00 / 2)
The public has soured and Bush and conservatism "big time," as America's #2 war criminal would say.  This creates an openning.  It's evident in all manner of signs, such as the 50/35 breakdown in Dem vs. Rep partisan id (with leaners).  The failure to respond to Katrina is the greatest single domestic symbol of this failure, but it's far from the only one.  And then there's global warming.  When things really fall apart like this, that's when there's an opportunity for a significant shift in direction.

(Additionally, there is a strong possibility for the first true realigning presidential election since 1932, which would take all the above and triple word score it.)

But the question is--a shift in direction to what?  The Democratic establishment's pattern that was spelled out by  Robert in Monterey in the post I was responding to is clear.  it is not going to shift to the left. It is going to try some combination of 1970s, 1980s, 1990s and 2000s GOP lite.  Anything else is going to have to come from folks like us, and from the American people more generally.

"You know what they say -- those of us who fail history... doomed to repeat it in summer school." -- Buffy The Vampire Slayer, Season 6, Episode 3


[ Parent ]
The Disconnect (4.00 / 2)
This very impressive and erudite discussion points up the radical disconnect between what the American people want and need, on the one hand, and what the corporate-backed power elite in legislative positions, think tanks and political parties think and do.

As Rosenberg and others have indicated, this disconnect has been a long time in the making. It has become particularly acute as the Bush administration and Congress have dug their heels into the fiasco in Iraq and refused to listen to the rumble of the people and back out of it.

The disconnect is also readily apparent now that the U.S. is becoming a truly backward post-industrialized society, socially speaking, as its federal government (with the support of both political parties) proceeds to dismantle the remnants of the increasingly weak and wobbly social welfare legislation that it refuses to fund.

Under this regime, unsurprisingly, the rich have indeed become extraordinarily rich, while the middle class and working class have been forced to drop further down the political and economic ladder with every passing day.

There is a revolution in the works as the American people become ever more aware of the extent to which they have been sold down the river by their own so-called "elected representatives" of both parties, who do the bidding of their corporate campaign financiers by legalizing the accelerated speed at which they can accumulate wealth and reap windfall profits by siphoning off the earnings of working Americans.

One of these days in the next decade or so new leaders are going to rise up to lead the sadder but wiser American people in their inevitable fight to bring down this plutocracy. I predict that they will belong to neither the Republican nor the Democratic Party.


[ Parent ]
That's an interesting point (4.00 / 1)
About the 1978 convention you described. '78 was the same year that Carter embraced neoliberalism with the 1978 Revenue Act, airline deregulation, and the Chrysler bailout (which may have been '79 but you get the picture). The Kennedy campaign in 1980 was indeed an effort to continue the liberal reformism, and perhaps that campaign needs new study. The points about Dukakis also jibe with what I'd argued.

I too believe we have a significant opportunity to push politics to the left, and agree that this Democratic leadership will not do that. I think it goes back to another vital point you made, when you said you reject the insider/outsider paradigm.

There are, of course, folks who consciously adopt an "insider" positioning and identity. For Democrats, doing so almost always involves repudiating the New Left legacy, dismissing folks in the activist party base who are of that legacy as either unrealistic, as losers, or as fools. These insiders then become divorced from the on-the-ground realities of American public opinion and voter concerns, as they reject people and movements that do authentically represent both. Instead these insiders rely on polls - which are merely a snapshot in time - and play for small victories, assuming that because they do not really know what is going on in the public mind, or that the public is supposedly more conservative than they, small victories are all they can manage.

These "insiders" then miss trend shifts like the ones we are witnessing, and instead convince themselves temporary poll shifts - like public approval of Bush after September 2001 - are themselves fundamental trend shifts. And so these "insiders" sign on to disastrous policies, like the Iraq War, that alienate voters and cause more misery. They are very good at tenaciously clinging to power, but little else.

So what I hear you saying is that as a project of the open left (both this site and as a movement) we need to abandon this insider/outsider mentality. The consultants and staffers and electeds should be in productive conversation with the activists and the netroots and anyone else who is politically engaged, as part of the construction of a broader movement. Pick up where we were cut off in the '70s, using new knowledge, new skills, and fitting a new situation, to continue to build a progressive politics that brings people into the houses of power and brings power to their houses.


[ Parent ]
Insiders (0.00 / 0)
Mr. Rosenberg:

Insider resistence to change is massive.

Insiders are, by definition, those who have successfully used the recent political and economic situation and trends. 

Secondly, it's human nature to derive a schemata (roughly, a particular psycho-epistemological Model) and then adjust the information input to the schemata. 

Third, humans put a high value on Risk avoidance.

Fourth, Communication only happens between equals. 

A successful schemata guiding Insider praxis allows the Insider to _think_ they are lowering their Risk.  As a political environment changes or, rather, as change becomes affective in the political environment the natural propensity for Risk avoidance tends - high probability - to make the Insider do what has worked in the past.  A current example is the Bush administration's harping on 9/11, releasing ever more inane Terrorist Alerts, and finding Al (Good ol' Al) Kadia controlling every Iraqi with an IED¹.  They keep doing this, not because they are affective now, but because they worked really well in the past.  The only way to break this loop is for ourside or inside communication that shifts the schemata and the actions springing therefrom.  But if the communicator is not accepted as equal by the communicatee then the latter simply ignores the message, and the channel from which that message was delivered, accepted.  This, too, can readily be seen in operation within the Bush admninistration.

Lawyers, the vast majority of politicians, are especially prone to the above dynamic.  First, their training is directed primarily to manipulation of an unquestioned and unquestionable body of knowledge (roughly, The Law.)  Second, they are trained to manipulate that body of knowledge in an adversarial climate (roughly, A Trial.) 

To be sure this process operates in all organizations, not merely the goverment. 

¹  Sounds like a birth method, doesn't it?


This Is Generally True, But... (0.00 / 0)
Your fourth premise (Communication only happens between equals) I reject outright.  There is all sorts of communication that goes up and down hierarchies.  The other three I agree with in general, but the degree to which they are true varies, and one of the things it varies with are factors associated with liberalism and conservatism.

Conservatives are considerably more risk-averse than liberals are, for example.  (Which is not to say they are particularly good at it, but that's a subject for another day.)  Robert Altemeyer's work on rightwing authoritarianism (RWA) shows that high-RWAs are significantly more likely to say that everything that comes down the pike is our most important problem.  Although RWA is only modestly correlated with liberalism and conservatism in the population at large, the correlation grows increasingly strong the more politically involved people are.  But RWA is just one factor associated with conservatism.

Similarly, liberals are more inclined to accept--even seek out--not only new data, but new models as well.  The conservative affinity for religious authority vs. the liberal affinity for scientific progress reflects a fundamental difference in orientation that makes liberals more open to change.

Finally, consrvatism is all about maintaining social barriers, and liberalism is about reducing them.  Historically, it's always been the case that liberals are more welcoming of new blood.

None of this is to deny the general truth of your propositions (except the fourth).  But it is to say that conservatives are much more prone to act this way than liberals are.

Bottom line: The problem--identified by Mike Lux in his original post, though he didn't put it precisely this way--is that Democratic insiders came to act more like typical conservatives in a number of ways.  And that same problem persists to this day.

Finally, it doesn't have to be this way.  It's always helpful to remember that humans evolved in small groups with rather flat social hierarchies, in conditions that favored a good deal of egalitarian behavior.  We are adaptable enough to live in a totally different sort of social structure, which is both large in size and structured into some fairly rigid and extensive hierarchies.  But this can hardly be called our natural preference.  Rather, it is the result of social history and pre-existing institutions to which we have adapted.  But history and instutions can both be remade to better serve the common good and better fit our basic nature.

"You know what they say -- those of us who fail history... doomed to repeat it in summer school." -- Buffy The Vampire Slayer, Season 6, Episode 3


[ Parent ]
communication in hierarchies (0.00 / 0)
There is all sorts of communication that goes up and down hierarchies.

Never been around or heard of anyone who lied to the boss?  Never been around or heard of mid-level management rewriting memos, action reports, or meeting minutes to fit higher management's known preconceptions?  Never seen or heard of directives from upper management that made one wonder if the entire Board of Directors were huffing glue?  Never been around or heard of people telling the boss, "I'll get right on it," then do nothing?  Never been around or heard of a total flaming disaster from worker bees strictly following orders from 'on high?'  Never been around or heard of reports making mountains out of molehills or molehills out of mountains?  Never heard of the reasons behind Challenger blowing up?  Never heard of widespread failure of the power grid from a local fault cascade ("Don't tell anybody.  We can fix it.  We can fix it.  We can fix it.  Oops.")? 

Shall I continue?  I've got lots more examples.

Obviously communication can and does occur in hierarchies but it only happens when those at different levels accept data flow from entities in different levels; when the context of the data flow is shared; when the different levels accept the data flow in the shared context as valid, e.g., worth listening to.  (To give a Quick & Dirty of what "equal" means ... there's more, much more, to it.)

The label 'RWA', as Prof. Altemeyer wrote, has nothing much to do with the political position espoused by an individual.  I run into plenty of RWAs on the Left - members of the SWP leap to mind - and I'm sure you have as well. 

Even given that, I agree with the general thrust of the rest of your argument.  And even expand on it a wee bit.

RWA/Conservatives privilege position in hierarchies much more than a Progressive does.  Can anyone imagine a Conservative wearing a 'Question Authority' button?  Can anyone not imagine a Conservative wearing a 'Obey Authority' button?  The result is 'orders' are more likely to passed within a RWA hierarchy than 'information.'  RWA are very likely, approaching certainty, to stifle their own thought processes and situation analysis in favor of the thought processes and analysis of their hierarchial superiors.  What this sets-up is a Information Processing structure lacking vital feedback loops, one of such being reports of success/fail going 'up' the hierarchy. 

The natural polar opposite of Right Wing Authoritarian is Left Wing Libertarian (LWL.)  This suggests a LWL is more likely, approaching certainty, to privilege their own situation analysis and thought processes over those stemming from entities with a higher hierarchial rank.  giving rise to the well known 'Herding Cats observation.  (LOL)  This is dysfunctional for unified action it has a dramatic and crucial benefit.  Our SDs, and we have them, are much more likely to accept communication from the grassroots (whatever that means) and adjust their message(s), strategies and tactics accordingly.  This doesn't mean they will but it does mean they might.  LWLs, therefore, are more likely to complete the feedback loop. 

Support for the premise behind Open Left.



[ Parent ]
Yes And No (0.00 / 0)
I'm generally sympathetic to what you're saying, but...

(1) No one ever said that communication was perfect.  It's not perfect within the same hierarchical level, either.  It's not just The Office, but just about every other sit-com that you've ever seen as well.

(2) The relationship between RWA and individual political positions is statistical, and grows increasing strong the more involved people are politically.

Overall, though, we're pretty much in agreement, I think.

"You know what they say -- those of us who fail history... doomed to repeat it in summer school." -- Buffy The Vampire Slayer, Season 6, Episode 3


[ Parent ]
Television (0.00 / 0)
Anyone who lived through the 1960s can tell you that TV by itself does not have a pacifying and trivializing effect on politics.  But I know what Mike was talking about.  And precisely because it wasn't the technology per se, it's a good idea not to go down that path here.

Paul, I was wondering if you would go down this path a little, because it seems to me that an important part of this narrative is, not per se television (as you write), but media consolidation generally. The fact that the information in your bar graphs is both surprising and unreported (perhaps surprising because unreported), points to this problem.  The fact that my paper has a whole section devoted to daily Dow-movements and not labor issues points this way as well.

Another example might be the 2000 election.  Not that there were many indications then that Gore would have been the answer to the systemic problems affecting our political system, or that he even would have governed differently than Clinton in any meaningful way, but the situation would certainly be less bleak.  I bring this up because it seems one of the more immediate reasons as to why Gore did not ascend to the presidency is the coordinated negative framing of Gore during the entire campaign (by a press that would "make him pay" for Clinton's supposed wrongdoing) and the subsequent unified call for stability and reconciliation when the outcome was in dispute (Somerby's dailyhowler.com is a good resource for this history).

The problem, of course, extends beyond Democrats not getting a fair shake.  In fact, I think that this is more a consequence of a consolidated media elite with "embedded" journalists than it is a coherent plan to take down Democrats (though maybe there is some of this, too).  In other words, the media should be understood less as anti-liberal conservatives than as anti-populist elites.  Not to be nostalgic for a media that never existed, but the history of media centralization seems to coincide with the history being discussed here.

 


Right, It's Not The Medium (0.00 / 0)
It's who controls it and what their agenda is.

Media consolidation is a big part of it. So, to, is the shift in elite attitudes, which largely abandoned any sort of real committment to the notion of a public trust.

The only niggle I have with your account is the claim that "the media should be understood less as anti-liberal conservatives than as anti-populist elites."

The first problem is that it accepts the misleading definition of liberalism as having nothing to do with economic matters, when that is actually the core meaning of American liberalism that conservatives have worked furiously to obliterate.  The second problem is that the media aren't anti-populist.  They absolutely love to play up rightwing populism.  This has the similar effect of obliterating the original 19th Century meaninig of populism.

It's more accurate to say that they're opposed to economic liberalism.

"You know what they say -- those of us who fail history... doomed to repeat it in summer school." -- Buffy The Vampire Slayer, Season 6, Episode 3


[ Parent ]
yeah, I agree (0.00 / 0)
Upon further reflection, I would back off of the anti-populist argument, and I think the opposition to economic liberalism, as you suggest, may be at the core.

However, the love of playing to right wing populism along with the right wing economic agenda would make it seem that their agenda reflects the Republican party platform.  I don't think that this is the case (not that you are suggesting that it is, just trying to explore this more-- ).

Perhaps their love of playing to the conservative social agenda (especially odious, I think, when creationism gets equal time with evolution, for example)is more an attempt to keep the political debate focused on social policy and religion in order to not talk about economic issues.  The difference is that the social issues are presented as ultimately "debatable," and even science in this regard becomes a social issue, while the core economic issues are treated as settled.

Anyway, thanks for the response


[ Parent ]
Very Insightful (0.00 / 0)
I've just made it through the entire thread. Thank you for the time and effort you've invested in this. As a 30-year veteran of progressive policy advocacy in DC -- both inside and outside government -- I now have a much better understanding of how the process is viewed by leftist academics 3000 miles away.

Many aspects of this comment interest me. (0.00 / 0)
Is Paul Rosenberg an academic?

Does one's proximity to DC act as a variable predicting the correctness of one's political analysis?

For example, if I were 1 mile away from DC, would my analysis of factors explaining US political activities by more accurate than if I were 8,000 miles away?

Do all 30 year veterans of progressive policy advocacy in DC share the same analysis of US progressive politics?  What about 25 year, or 35 year veterans?  Is there a sliding scale of accuracy, in which a 5 year veteran of progressive policy advocacy in DC has a certain percentage of correctness, whereas a 60 year likewise veteran would approach nearly 100% correctness?

Given our astounding degree of loss of progressive politics of nearly all types over the past 26 to 30 years at least, is that loss necessary to explain?

Myself, I'm just a working stiff with some college under his belt living far away from DC in the Deep South, so I would never dare to offer arguments about why Democrats and liberal policies have so consistently and disastrously lost over the past couple of decades, nor would I ever, ever mention something like Ross Perot's undermining of Bush Sr's conservative credentials aided Clinton's bare squeak through victories.

Given that I'm a bit over 600 miles from DC, my views are not reliable, though I must be more correct than Paul Rosenberg, or perhaps it helps that I'm not an academic, maybe my percentage of insightfulness has just gone up.


[ Parent ]
Clarification (0.00 / 0)
"Does one's proximity to DC act as a variable predicting the correctness of one's political analysis?"

I never meant to imply that proximity to DC had anything whatsoever to do with the "correctness" of one's political analysis.


[ Parent ]
Maybe it was just me, then (0.00 / 0)
But it sure sounded like an off-handedly snotty dismissal.  Could be just a wrong interpretation on my part.

[ Parent ]
I think there is also an argument for a conflict of interests (0.00 / 0)
Often, discussions of this type seem to assume that Democratic "insiders", which include the candidates and politicians themselves, advisers, consultants, think tanks, etc., benefit only from electoral victories.

But there is, in this world, in this nation, other types of rewards.

With a two party system of this type, both parties not only vie for votes, but for the appreciations and finances which flow from the wealthiest and most privileged -- which variously may be called the upper classes or the power elites, etc., such as the generational millionaires, centimillionaires, and billionaires, and corporate, investment, and banking elites.

Given that we know that power, financing, and rewards such as funded speech tours, positions at think tanks, corporate board memberships -- real, actual, personal rewards -- flow to those who most eagerly seek to serve those upper classes / power elites, it seems highly improbable that this set of incentives and disincentives will go ignored.

If I were an insider schemer (or acting solely on subconscious motivations of which I was nobly unaware, whatever you prefer), I know that I could set myself up for quite a bit of wingnut welfare by, say, backing the "free trade" policies which might cause my own (or my candidate's) electoral loss.

If you can be a lucratively rewarded probable loser versus a financially unrewarded maybe winner, the likelihood that no one will choose the former approaches zero.

During the 1990s the DLC-type approach was clearly to argue that the Democratic Party was the best and most efficient party to carry out the interests of the upper classes.

The fact that policies such as NAFTA were to be shotgun blasts directed at the Democratic base was less weighted than the need to seek upper class support.

Although the Democratic Party is the only one of the two major parties capable of representing the interests of the great majority of the population versus a vanishingly tiny elite, it will continue to be a struggle at each and every level to have that tendency be the winning one, versus the great incentives to lazily pursue the DLC strain of wingnut welfare.


Great job, as always, Paul. Kudos, brother. n/t (0.00 / 0)


Post-Materialism (0.00 / 0)
>...Researcher Robert Inglehard has been the leading theorist connecting this data to Maslow's hierarchy of needs.

  Oops, Rosenberg, that s/b Ronald Inglehart 1977: The Silent Revolution: Changing Values and Political Styles Among Western Publics. Princeton: Princeton University Press.
  Funny, how I've seen Inglehart cited everywhere from the neo-con journal The Public Interest and, "The Cultural Contradictions of Capitalism, " by neo-con Daniel Bell to neo-marxist Claus Offe.


The OTHER Neo-cons (4.00 / 1)
Once upon a time--from around the mid-60s to the mid-70s in particular--the word "neo-con" had a much broader meaning that included some folks who never become like those so labelled today.  These folks were not distinctively associated with Leo Strauss and his influence, nor were they necessarily all that conservative.  What was true was that they had leftist backgrounds, and a pre-occupation with matters of culture that made them sympathetic to some conservative arguments and skeptical of what they saw as historically naive faith on the part of their liberal contemporaries.

Three people in particular stand out as characteristic of this--Bell, Nathan Glazier and Daniel Patrick Moynihan (who was, at one time, Nixon's principle advisor on domestic policy).  The title of Bell's book alone tells you that he was no neo-con in the mold of Francis Fukiyama, much less Daniel Pearl.  In the 1990s, Glazier wrote a rather insightful book, We Are All Multiculturalists Now, evidence of a continued intellectual evolution and open-mindedness totally unlike what happened with the later rightward march of what we now think of as neo-cons.  And Moynihan, of course, went on to become one of the strongest liberal voices in the US Senate, except for his insance belief in the myth of a Social Security crisis.

Somewhere, there's probably someone (if not half a dozen or more someones) writing their PhD thesis on these guys and the how they came to differ so much from the neo-cons as we know them today.

"You know what they say -- those of us who fail history... doomed to repeat it in summer school." -- Buffy The Vampire Slayer, Season 6, Episode 3


[ Parent ]
Isn't Marketing Itself Ultimately The Underlying Cancer? (0.00 / 0)
EVERY problem I come across at one point or another has its roots in marketing, but it seems we can't do anything about it since it's "bad for business". 

Democrats and Progressives, if they have made ANY mistake, it's that they have NOT succumbed to the faith in marketing that the GOP and Conservatives have: Lie, cheat and steal to close the deal and make the sale.

(Sorry, my first post was buried in one of the threads above)


Other points (4.00 / 2)
First off Paul, it is good to see you getting back into the fray, but it is hard to find you as you keep popping up in new venues!

I know you weren't trying to be comprehensive, but I think there is a bit too much of blaming the victim in this discussion (and the ones that triggered it).

Some other factors to be considered.

1. The US entered into the era of globalization unprepared. We were so used to being able to use our vast raw materials and gunboat diplomacy to get our way that we didn't see the rise of viable economic rivals. This included Europe and Japan and more recently China and India. Even Russia has bounced back and is now competing internationally, something the USSR didn't really do. We haven't "won" a war since the end of WWII, but we act as if we can still force states to do as we wish. We can blow them up, but we can't force them to become economic clients.

2. The rise of TV in the electoral process. This is important because TV is so expensive. This has led to the corruption of the electoral process by big money. And big money comes from big business. Since the general tendency of the Dems is to limit business it handicaps them when it comes to asking them for money. This is why labor unions and independent entrepreneurs (like trial lawyers) are so important to the Dems. They can't match the wealth of the industrial class, however.

The swing in fund raising in the current cycle doesn't represent a change of heart by the ruling class, just an attempt to hedge their bets if the Dems gain power.

3. The concentration of wealth and power in the second "Gilded Age". We know about the shakeout in the media business. There are not only fewer outlets, but they are owned by large industrial enterprises (like GE) which side with the GOP. This has biased coverage. Consolidation has extended to other areas as well. For example the push to eliminate the estate tax is the work of just 18 super wealthy families, most of whom you have probably never heard of. If you are interested here's a report on their efforts:

Estate Tax Report PDF.

A similar situation exists in the military sector where less that 50 firms control almost all the expenditures. Just the other night the PBS show "Now" had a story on SIAC, one of the biggest contractors. I doubt that one person in 100 has ever heard of them. These firms are closely linked to government with their top management levels coming from (and going to) federal positions and the DoD. They also have been buying politicians for decades with the result that there is no opposition to an expansive military policy. This has implications for social spending and even affects our foreign policy.

During WWI people complained about "war profiteers". These firms are now better at controlling their message and such statements don't appear anymore.

The Dems (and certainly the general public) fail to realize how few people are pulling the strings in this country. If you don't know who the puppet master is you are liable to misread the dynamics of the situation.

We live in a oligopoly for all practical purposes and using strictly democratic means to change this will be difficult. The rulers control the political and economic power as well as the mass media. Lately the GOP has even been subverting the electoral process itself. This is not the failure of the Dems to get their message out, this is a fundamental defect in our present democratic institutions.

Changing this won't be easy as the failure of the Dems to enact even modest changes currently illustrate. It's like playing with a stacked deck. First you have to understand how the game is fixed if you are to win.

Policies not Politics


Connecting the Dots (0.00 / 0)
These are all good points, but of course you know there are others you could make as well.  And the question is how do we connect them all.  I was trying to set up some historical background as one way of organizing them.  If I had to summarize the one's you've brought up, I'd categorize them in terms of "democracy vs. plutocracy," and that's precisely the way I'd say we should frame the fight going into the future to reverse and/or counter these trends.

It's not a fight against wealth per se, but it is a fight against the idea that wealthy people should call all the shots.  Just as the fight against theocracy is not a fight against religion, but a fight against religious dictatorship. 

One thing puzzles me, though.  Your statement that "there is a bit too much of blaming the victim in this discussion."  I saw it as precisely the opposite--as saying "these are the factors that made the struggle so difficult." I wasn't blaming anyone for why those conditions obtained.  To do that, we would have to look back even farther into the past--particularly (though hardly exclusively) to the historical reality of slavery and its semi-feudal aftermath in the American South.

"You know what they say -- those of us who fail history... doomed to repeat it in summer school." -- Buffy The Vampire Slayer, Season 6, Episode 3


[ Parent ]
Yes, but (0.00 / 0)
Actually my remarks about blaming the victim weren't directed at you, but rather the follow on discussions that cited your entry.

In addition there is a steady stream of discussion of this nature elsewhere in the blogosphere and the among the pundit class.

Many of them take the form: "this is what the Dems did wrong in the past and if they only follow my advice now everything will be alright."

DailyKos has a few, but mostly I see it in print magazines like "The Nation" and "The American Prospect".

Bob Shrum has been going around flogging his book recently and offering fresh advice even though his track record as a political consultant is, to put it mildly, mixed at best.

If one doesn't recognize that one is up against an almost invisible powerful enemy one ends up trying to treat TB with bloodletting as they did in the 18th Century. You need to recognize your opponents if you are going to counter them effectively.

Policies not Politics


[ Parent ]
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