Swing Liberals

by: Matt Stoller

Mon Jan 14, 2008 at 15:28


From Iowa to New Hampshire, Obama lost ground among the 25-29 year old demographic, liberals, and the angry with Bush vote.  And these kinds of columns from Paul Krugman aren't going to help reverse the trend.

On the Democratic side, John Edwards, although never the front-runner, has been driving his party's policy agenda. He's done it again on economic stimulus: last month, before the economic consensus turned as negative as it now has, he proposed a stimulus package including aid to unemployed workers, aid to cash-strapped state and local governments, public investment in alternative energy, and other measures.

Last week Hillary Clinton offered a broadly similar but somewhat larger proposal. (It also includes aid to families having trouble paying heating bills, which seems like a clever way to put cash in the hands of people likely to spend it.) The Edwards and Clinton proposals both contain provisions for bigger stimulus if the economy worsens.

And you have to say that Mrs. Clinton seems comfortable with and knowledgeable about economic policy. I'm sure the Hillary-haters will find some reason that's a bad thing, but there's something to be said for presidents who know what they're talking about.

The Obama campaign's initial response to the latest wave of bad economic news was, I'm sorry to say, disreputable: Mr. Obama's top economic adviser claimed that the long-term tax-cut plan the candidate announced months ago is just what we need to keep the slump from "morphing into a drastic decline in consumer spending." Hmm: claiming that the candidate is all-seeing, and that a tax cut originally proposed for other reasons is also a recession-fighting measure - doesn't that sound familiar?

Anyway, on Sunday Mr. Obama came out with a real stimulus plan. As was the case with his health care plan, which fell short of universal coverage, his stimulus proposal is similar to those of the other Democratic candidates, but tilted to the right.

For example, the Obama plan appears to contain none of the alternative energy initiatives that are in both the Edwards and Clinton proposals, and emphasizes across-the-board tax cuts over both aid to the hardest-hit families and help for state and local governments. I know that Mr. Obama's supporters hate to hear this, but he really is less progressive than his rivals on matters of domestic policy.

In short, the stimulus debate offers a pretty good portrait of the men and woman who would be president.

The data shows that creative class liberals and/or women and/or ideologically liberal blocks moved from Obama to Clinton.  So far, Moveon, Democracy for America, blogs, and associated creative class liberal groups have remained either completely or mostly neutral in the primary.  This is reflective not of any top-down decision-making, but of a basic lack of passion from the audience of those groups for any candidate.  As one can see from the shifts of those groups from Iowa to New Hampshire, these are swing groups.  That said, it's not clear to me that the internet left is that tied into these liberal voting blocks direct.  We might be, but no one really knows.

I'm pretty sympathetic to Obama because his media reform proposals are quite good.  But the more I hear about his other policies, the less inclined I am to give him credence as a progressive.  And while ideology is only one form of identity-creation, it's one that would benefit Obama. 

Anyway, it looks to me like the swing liberals are up for grabs in the primary.

Matt Stoller :: Swing Liberals

Tags: , , , , , , (All Tags)
Print Friendly View Send As Email
Swing Liberals | 35 comments
-_- (0.00 / 0)
Yay, Krugman has, like many elitists, confused progressivism with socialism!

Others... (4.00 / 2)
...seem to have confused progressivism with whatever happens to come out of Barack Obama's mouth.

More tax cuts (and certainly "long term" ones) are the last thing this country needs.  We need serious investment in our people and in our infrastructure.


[ Parent ]
This comment could only have come from someone.... (4.00 / 1)
....who doesn't know what either progressivism or socialism are.

To imply that Paul Krugman is a socialist is right out of the 1950s.

Interesting rhetorical choice.


[ Parent ]
Energy policy another example (4.00 / 1)
My first inkling that Obama was not as progressive as I hoped was when I learned he was the Democratic leader of the Senate Liquid Coal Caucus. Thankfully, due to pressure from supporters and environmentalists he has since mostly backed away from supporting liquid coal.

Still, the fact that he chose to use his limited political capital as a Senator to head this caucus says a lot to me about where his political priorities were coming into his freshman term. He has shown more Senate leadership on this decidedly non-progressive issue -- doubling-down our investment in carbon-based fuels -- than progressive causes such as getting out of Iraq, domestic surveillance or universal health care.

I'll gladly volunteer, vote and canvass for him if he wins the nomination (ditto for Edwards or Clinton). Still, Obama's too many "to the right" stances are keeping me on the sidelines during the primaries.

They call me Clem, Clem Guttata. Come visit wild, wonderful West Virginia Blue


i keep forgetting about that (0.00 / 0)
Liquid coal.. wtf...

[ Parent ]
Coal in Southern Illinois (0.00 / 0)
I think it was initially a constituent thing.  He's thinking more broadly now.

John McCain--He's not who you think he is.

[ Parent ]
About damn time (0.00 / 0)
He did something for Illinois. Sorry that was just venting.

[ Parent ]
carbondale, anyone? (4.00 / 1)
it's not named carbondale for no reason...

end the blurring--vote steve novick for u.s. senate in oregon

[ Parent ]
Energy policy (4.00 / 2)
The league of conservation voters gave Obama the highest rating of all the candidates, a 96 compared with Clinton's score of 90 and Edwards' 59 (although that's taking into account Edwards' more conservative Senate record).

Obama didn't put alternative energy in his stimulus plan, but his comprehensive plan to fight global warming and drastically reduce reliance on oil has some of the most comprehensive funding for alternative energy out there.

I can see Krugman's issues with Obama's preference for giving cash over targeting programming to those being affected by the current downturn (although I agree with Obama's approach), but bringing up alternative energy is an unfair slam.


[ Parent ]
I wondered about that... (0.00 / 0)
I also thought Krugman's statement comparing candidates' energy polices was misleadingly negative toward Obama, since I'd just heard an environmentalist praising his plan as spending more than most others on green investments. 

I've been a big fan of Krugman for years, but BDdem's comment reinforces my sense that he may be observing (and labeling) the candidates through some biases that aren't grounded in a full description of the facts, and assigning relative importance to their differences in ways that don't make sense to me. 

That being said, I have to confess that I'm not clear about how the candidates' proposals really compare on key issues.

Does anyone know of a relatively neutral comparison of these that includes energy, the economy, tax policy, trade, media, telecom/Internet, political reform, etc?  If so, please post a link.

If something like this doesn't exist, maybe we should consider putting one together in some collaborative process.  We could use candidates' published proposals as a starting point, maybe followed by discussion threads on each of the key policy areas.


[ Parent ]
Energy policy, trusting in biofuels, and other rivers in Egypt.... (0.00 / 0)
[ Parent ]
BCdem -- to clarify... (0.00 / 0)
I'm not sure if you are referring to Krugman or I (or to both of us) in saying "bringing up alternative energy is an unfair slam."

To be clear, my point was more that Obama's choice to be Dem. leader of the Senate caucus was telling. No matter how good the rest of his energy plan might be, my central point still stands. He has not stepped up to be the Dem. leader of any other caucus that I know of. It concerns me greatly that he picked this issue as his place to make a legislative mark.

Recent actions as a Senator mean a lot more to me than campaign policy statements.

They call me Clem, Clem Guttata. Come visit wild, wonderful West Virginia Blue


[ Parent ]
I fear that an Obama presidency... (4.00 / 3)
...would require constant pressure of that sort.  Increasingly I'm coming to believe that we should all be taking his bipartisan/postpartisan rhetoric at face value.

What I suspect is going to happen during this election cycle if he's the nominee is that his centrist positioning will be redefined as the new "far left".  And we'll have lost on every single issue across the board--now and into the future--before the votes are even cast.


[ Parent ]
RE: I fear that an Obama presidency. (0.00 / 0)
This is exactly my fear. This is what I see.

This may be the most concise statement of our combined thoughts on what all that soft "bipartisan" talk means. "What kind of president would Obama be." Of course that is central to the debate we should be having.

Central to our debate. Please everyone take a breath, don't spend time reading or commenting on "horse-race" coverage.

We have to invest all your time (our reading, writing and  finally our decisions) on positions and outcomes. What kind of President, what will be the outcomes.


--

The government has a defect: it's potentially democratic. Corporations have no defect: they're pure tyrannies. -Chomsky


[ Parent ]
Its the same for Clinton... (0.00 / 0)
Unfortunately the same is true for Clinton, who has sullied the liberal label for far too long.  At this point her policies are just a half step better in most areas to Obama's and the same results will happen.  Corporate welfare, protection of big pharm, free trade, etc. will all likely remain the same or grow under either candidate, while the right declaims these policies as being 'too liberal' because they would take it even further.  The Kucinich and even Edwards positions would be labeled stark raving pinko and we will once again be left fighting that uphill battle of trying to sell our enormously popular ideas to a population that has been brainwashed into believing that those ideas are really bad.

I can only hope my pessimism is completely unfounded, but the media is utterly corrupt at a level I never imagined possible and it makes the broader discourse so scary.


[ Parent ]
yes we are (4.00 / 3)
Anyway, it looks to me like the swing liberals are up for grabs in the primary.

I basically fall into your category of a youngish (30) creative-class liberal, and I'll probably be making my decision close to or on February 5th (I vote in NJ). Same with a bunch of similarly-demographic'd people I know (not that anecdotal evidence means all that much). I'm OK with any of the Dems, but this "lack of passion for any one candidate" that you (accurately) mention leaves me very interested in what they do & say between now and then. And that Krugman piece definitely hurts Obama ("he really is less progressive than his rivals on matters of domestic policy" - ouch!), since Krugman's one of the few MSM voices I generally respect.

And while I'm not post-partisan in the least (I want REVENGE on the Republicans), I hate the invective that distinguishes the intra-party nomination battle. Considering how similar their politics are overall, it strikes me as odd that Clinton and Obama and Edwards supporters seem to so often regard the other's candidate with such hostility. My advice would be to take it down a notch and save your fury for the actual enemy, the people who have systematically degraded this nation for decades and will stop at nothing to defeat us in the fall.


Clinton seems to be killing herself with the creative class lately... (0.00 / 0)
...with her surrogates' line of race-baiting smears in a Democratic primary against Barack Obama.  While I was never for her in the primaries, I never questioned that I would vote for Hillary in the general. 

That's no longer the case.  Hillary can get all the Krugman raves in the world for these type of policies, but it makes no difference to me.  Richard Nixon had some pretty good progressive policies too.  For me, character is the issue.  If this is how the Clintons deal with dissent in the party, I shudder to think how they'll handle the power of the presidency.  If Hillary is the nominee, I'll most likely vote with the Green Party in November.  I live in Massachusetts, so this won't make a difference electorally.

Hillary lost me in the primaries in 2002.  She lost me in November this week.


[ Parent ]
I am so frustrated (4.00 / 4)
that so many creative class liberals in Iowa never seem to have even heard any arguments against Obama.

People who don't read blogs (and that is most people here) have never heard of McClurkin, they didn't know Obama voted for Bush's 2005 energy bill, they never heard any reason why progressives should be concerned about Obama's post-partisan message.

Just a few days ago I was talking with someone in the GLBT community in Des Moines who had never heard about the McClurkin event. I know a lot of environmentalists who hadn't heard Obama would consider new nuclear power plants. The list goes on. It's like the Edwards and Clinton campaigns didn't even try to make any case against Obama with this constituency.

Join the Iowa progressive community at Bleeding Heartland.


Not alike (4.00 / 4)
Chris keeps talking about "Angry with Bush" democrats.  Angry with Bush Democrats want partisanship and they want it directed outward at Bush and the lockstep Republicans and not inward.  Bipartisanship = bad, thank you.

What I want is three things, at a minimum: out of Iraq (or at least as close as we can get), universal health care, and partisanship.  As important as Iraq is, it is at the bottom of my list.  Barely above things like working to reduce inequality in our society and reintroducing the regulation of corporations.

The problem with identity politics is that it masks more than it reveals.  All members of the CBC don't vote the same.  John Lewis and Artur Davis have very different records even though each is an African American Democrat from a majority minority district in the south.

The assumption is that Obama is more of a straight up-and-down old style liberal like Jesse Jackson rather than being pretty moderate on his progressive punch scores. To paraphrase Jesse from 88. "I'd rather have Jesse Jackson in a wheelchair than Barack Obama on a horse."  I like the old style, liberal voting, populist anti-Republican rhetoric, thank you.

At least some Democrats may have felt that Obama was ultimately another Jesse Jackson: a number two finisher who could be ignored on the way to the victory stand.  They may have taken the patronizing notion that AA voters would be upset by treating Obama as a real candidate subjerct to attack and examination instead of a free pass down the second place finish lane.  After January 3 and Iowa, that went out the window and things got rougher than they should have because there is simply not enough time for the full process to work out.  McClurkin was to me a really serious problem.  A deal breaker, possibly.


[ Parent ]
I feel ya, but one question (0.00 / 0)
What would you do if Clinton or Obama were the nominee then?

[ Parent ]
Vote (0.00 / 0)
Probably hold my nose and vote for them.

[ Parent ]
I Think That's Changing (4.00 / 1)
at least on the Clinton side.  She seems much more intent on battling Obama for younger voters, especially women, and liberals. She's started to mention that energy bill vote, for example.  She also went after him on abortion rights in NH.

I honestly don't know what Edwards is trying to do.  From what I heard this morning, he's still trying to paint himself on the same side as Obama.  Maybe he hopes Obama will fall and he'll move into his position?  Seems unlikely to me.  Why Edwards didn't hit Obama along with Clinton in Iowa as a corporate Democrat, painting himself as the lone outsider, I have no idea.


[ Parent ]
Edwards is already being demonized by the wingers, the MSM, (0.00 / 0)
and, most unforgivably, by the Democratic party establishment. All of whom, are trying to paint him as "too angry". Some of his more . . .  how can I say this kindly, supporters are running for the hills because they see him as a lone wolf who cannot win. I'm willing to grant Edwards the rhetorical room to play nice with someone, even if only for the sake of playing nice. Better to save the overt challenges for the candidate who is merely "likeable enough".

[ Parent ]
Demonized? (4.00 / 1)
I don't think Dems are demonizing him, but it's true that some have complained about his rhetoric (personally I find his anti-corporate rhetoric to be the most appealing thing about him).

My main question about Edwards is not why he's being nice to Obama now, he has very few options left and none of them are particularly good.  What I will never understand is why he didn't go after him in Iowa at the same time he went after Clinton.  Obama and Clinton have almost exactly the same voting records in the Senate.  Obama is surrounded by lobbyists (though mostly state ones) and Wall Street types.  It seems to me like Edwards could have painted himself as the one outsider (and then prayed no one read anything about his early Senate voting record).  When you're running an insurgent campaign, it's not enough to take down one of two establishment candidates, you have to take down both (and Obama is every bit as much as an establishment candidate as Clinton, it's just a somewhat different establishment).


[ Parent ]
Edwards was just voting his state ... (0.00 / 0)
but it seems he has refrained from intra-party battles too much

[ Parent ]
I agree some of what you're saying (0.00 / 0)
She's definitely going after him with considerable success on women.  However, how does her divisive new strategy inserting race into the mix help her with younger voters?  It's turned me off completely (I'm 24).

Regarding Edwards, he seems to be piling everything into Nevada and having some success.  Latest numbers there:
O - 32
C - 30
E - 27

Hopefully if Edwards does reasonably well, he'll get back into the narrative and the campaign will take a more positive turn and get back to the issues.


[ Parent ]
What a charmed, teflon-coated life Obama has led. (0.00 / 0)
What's the opposite of battle tested? The Clintons can't really take him on with gusto because all three are so much alike, and because Billary live in fear of alienating black voters. And unless you happen to attend an Edwards event, you won't hear him criticize Obama because the MSM's been working so hard to promote the falsehood that their platforms are substantially similar.

[ Parent ]
They're hitting him pretty hard right now, it's ugly n/t (0.00 / 0)


[ Parent ]
As long as Tony Rezko is NOT yet a household word, (0.00 / 0)
and as long as his supporters can haunt these boards and still exist in blissful ignorance of his shameful senate record, they're not hitting him nearly hard enough.

[ Parent ]
An open mind for Obama at first.... (4.00 / 3)
but not anymore.

I never intended to vote for Hillary in the primary.  Obama or Edwards were it.  I looked at Obama but his rhetoric failed to inspire me because I want a substantive fight to destroy the Rethuglican brand.  I want the policies that a dingbat commentor above called too socialist.

This country doesn't need more-of-the-same.  It needs a revolutionary kick in the ass to the left.  It's the moral thing to do.  I won't pontificate on why I think Edwards is the best choice.  I'll just say that Obama lost me a long time ago.  Krugman only documents it after the fact.


Goolsbee (0.00 / 0)
His economic advisor dissed Sicko.

Obama is not so much post-partisan but third way. Millenials are sick of Democratic-Republican gridlock and want to do things themselves, i.e., MySpace, Facebook.

Banned for posting five straight diaries.


[ Parent ]
And George freakin' Will .. (4.00 / 1)
couldn't stop gushing about Goolsbee ...  that ought to tell you something too

[ Parent ]
Unitalicize (n/t) (0.00 / 0)


Banned for posting five straight diaries.

[ Parent ]
Very Scary (4.00 / 1)
Obama gives the impression of someone who is willing to negotiate anything away in order to save his grand vision
of a post-partisan America.  No wonder Ben Nelson is on board.

Don't (0.00 / 0)
Just listen to Krugman. I have a lot of respect for Paul and indeed own every one of his books. However he's not the only progressive weighing in. In fact Robert Reich weighed in and called Obama's the best.

http://robertreich.b...


John McCain: Beacuse lobbyists should have more power


Swing Liberals | 35 comments
USER MENU

Open Left Campaigns

SEARCH

   

Advanced Search

QUICK HITS
STATE BLOGS
Powered by: SoapBlox