McCain Hits Obama On Residual Forces

by: Chris Bowers

Wed Feb 27, 2008 at 12:42


There is more than one way to engage the Iraq Blurring Strategy. While McCain has declined the take the Joe Lieberman approach of "no one wants to end the war more than me, but..." he has instead adopted the approach of "I don't want to end the war, but neither does Obama, and we agree on the reasons why." Here is McCain:

"I'm not embarrassed to tell you that I did not watch the Democrat debate last night," McCain said, "but I am told that Senator Obama made the statement that if Al Qaeda came back to Iraq after he withdraws -- after the American troops are withdrawn -- then he would send military troops back, if Al Qaeda established a military base in Iraq. I have some news: Al Qaeda is in Iraq. Al Qaeda, it's called Al Qaeda in Iraq, and my friends if we left they wouldn't be establishing a base, they wouldn't be establishing a base, they'd be taking a country. And I'm not going to allow that to happen my friends. I will not surrender. I will not surrender to Al Qaeda.

"It's pretty remarkable when Al Qaeda is in Iraq, and want to withdraw from Iraq and then say you will go back to Iraq if they have a base there. That's -- when you examine that statement it's pretty remarkable."

One of the main problems with the leading Democratic candidates promising to keep residual American military forces in Iraq is that such plans provide continuing justification for keeping American troops in Iraq, and comparatively little justification for withdrawal. Both Obama and Clinton have promised to keep residual troops in Iraq in order to attack Al Qaeda, although in fairness Obama has said that in his plan these troops might not actually be based in Iraq but instead just over the border. This position causes a serious credibility problem for withdrawal of any sort. As McCain points out, if you think American troops should be in Iraq to fight terrorists, then why withdraw the troops at all?

As long leading Democrats are arguing that we need troops in Iraq to carry out missions like "fighting terrorists," it severely weakens the public argument to engage in any sort of withdrawal. Democratic promises to keep residual forces in Iraq in general, and now Obama's promises to keep residual forces in Iraq in particular, have a net result of pre-blurring the Iraq issue even for Republicans like McCain who refuse to even say they want to end the war. Not only do residual forces give McCain further amminition on why we should stay in Iraq, but it also gives more credence to the argument that Democrats don't really want to end the war. It might be too late for Obama to promise no residual troops at this point, but as the campaign moves forward he is going to have to do a much better job of differentiating his position on Iraq, and his rational behind that position, from McCain's.

Update: Obama hits back:

"I have some news for John McCain," Obama said,  according to The Politico. "There was no Al Qaeda in Iraq until George Bush and John McCain" started their war.

That will likely become a stock message for Obama. He also uncorked this:

"John McCain may like to say he wants to follow Osama bin Laden to the gates of Hell, but so far all he's done is follow George Bush into a misguided war in Iraq."

That is a decent comeback from Obama, but it mainly talks about the decision to go to war rather than the decision on what to do in the future. He needs clearer differentiation on both in order to really bury McCain, and the Iraq war, once and for all.  

Chris Bowers :: McCain Hits Obama On Residual Forces

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Does he have to say "my friends" so much (0.00 / 0)
is that like subconscious reflex against the fact that he has none in the GOP?

This is why the Edwards position was the best. Iraq govt gets its shit together or we are out in 10 months, end of story.

If we know Al Qaeda is in Iraq then why don't we go get them now? And if we don't know where they are then how do we know they are there?

I say we nuke Al Qaeda from space if they show their ugly face. No fuss no muss, and Iran gets the fallout winds - BONUS!  

Michael Bloomberg, prince of corporate welfare


There are TWO Repsonses For Obama: (4.00 / 1)
1. To point out that there WERE NO Al Queda in Iraq before we invaded and there won't be any after we leave because the Iraqis will take care of them and are taking care of them, far better than we ever could, because they have much better intelligence on the ground.

2. To point out that the vast majority of Americans favor withdrawal and that's just what he's going to do, while McCain favors another 50 years of war.

And when McCain tries to "clarify" his statements as he did recently, then attack him again on his "victory" pronouncements: "we've been promised 'victory' since 2003 and we're still there and if McCain is elected 'victory' will be just around the corner for another 4 years!"  


response vs. substance (4.00 / 1)
I think you are right on as far as your suggested response. But there is still the question of policy. Why have residual troops at all? Your first point addresses the substance of the Al Queda angle. To add to that, I think that logic and experience indicate that intelligence and law enforcement are the best tools we have for reducing terrorism. Military solutions mainly serve to swell the ranks of terrorist organizations. If we need a troop presence to protect an embassy, I say fuck it. Why do we have to have an embassy in Iraq? Anyone with half a brain knows that the only reason to stay in any form is the same as the reason we went in. To control the oil. Can a prominent politician besides Ron Paul finally say that it is immorral to occupy a country to control their resources? Let's get the fuck out and start spending that money on clean energy at home.

miasmo.com

[ Parent ]
Residual Forces beg the question (0.00 / 0)
When will they come home?

Last I heard, neither of the Democratic candidates were willing to promise that all US forces would be out of Iraq by the end of their first term.  

Meanwhile, McCain is OK with having some US presence in Iraq for 50, or even 100 years.

So, how long do Clinton and/or Obama envision keeping the "residual forces" in Iraq?  At least 5 years and less than 100 years - but will narrow that down a bit?

They need to take a more "Edwardian" stance - set a timeline and stick to it.  There's new ammunition on the time-line issue,too - just look to Iraq's northern border and in ground invasion by Turkey.  Gates has asked them to withdraw quickly - and implicit time-line, no?  Apparently, the Turks feel that it is, because their response was to follow the Bush Strategy and declare that setting a time-line was out of the question.  Does McCain support a timeline for the Turkish invasion of Iraq, as suggested by the Sec. of Defense?  If so, why not one for the US invasion of Iraq?


"It sounds wrong...
     ...but its right."


[ Parent ]
McCain favors another 50 years of war????? (0.00 / 0)
Wow.
McCain favors another 50 years of war.

If that's true, and the Dems find out, the election's over!
Do you have any evidence? A quote perhaps?

And after we pull out there won't be any Al Queda in Iraq?

Interesting.


[ Parent ]
um, how about 10,000 (0.00 / 0)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v...

he said at a town hall about a month ago 100 years. It was big news. google for 100 years, lots of video and coverage. Obama is going to beat him up over and over for this.

Michael Bloomberg, prince of corporate welfare


[ Parent ]
100 years (0.00 / 0)
Yes, he said he would stay there 100 years if necessary. I'm sure Clinton and Obama would say the same thing. It's a tautology, what McCain said. They would just differ on the definition of what "if necessary" was. So they would add "but it won't be necessary."

Even so, it's a huge leap from there to say he favors war for 50 years. Do you have a quote?


[ Parent ]
"Do you have a quote?" (4.00 / 1)
Click on the YouTube link and listen to McCain agrre that even 100 more years in Iraq is OK with him.

How do you think he'll pay for that 100 years of occupation?

"It sounds wrong...
     ...but its right."


[ Parent ]
Good response (0.00 / 0)
I think that Obama response is quite good. He shifts the blame to McCain for helping create terrorists in Iraq, and it naturally leads to the next concept: staying there is only creating more.

Hillary couldn't use this approach because of her earlier votes.


Meh (0.00 / 0)
The name is a killer in terms of sound bite politics, which we can certainly expect the repubs to exploit to the hilt, but outside of that consideration, McCain's point doesn't hold water, since you can quite reasonably make the argument that, in addition to the US having brought Al Qaeda in Mesopatamia to Iraq, the continued U.S. presence in Iraq is  something Al Qaeda in Mesopatamia uses as a justification for its own presence there. In the absence of an occupation, the Iraqi gov't such as it is, would be able to take action against AQM without weakening itself to accusations of being puppet's of the U.S.

The peace movement's project for the next 8 months (0.00 / 0)
is to nail McCain to the wall as the candidate of all war all the time -- and to push Obama to sharpen his contrast. We need to get out of Obama as strong "end the war" statements as we can NOW, because we are going to have to push like crazy to overcome the inertia in the system once we elect him. Said similarly here.

Can it happen here?

Disagree slightly regarding (0.00 / 0)
your update. I don't think Obama should even try to explain in more detail.

Call it a "reverse blurring" strategy, but the bottom line is to turn this into McCain = pro-Iraq War / Obama = anti-Iraq War.

They are great, short soundbites that will be played on the news, and they will cement a notion that already exists.


Public Knowledge (0.00 / 0)
I'd agree more with Chris if people actually understood there was no Al Qaeda in Iraq before the invasion, but they don't.  Most people think we attacked Iraq because they were behind 9/11.  Heck, if Hussein where behind 9/11, I'd be in favor of the Iraq war.

[ Parent ]
Obama morphs Osama Bin Laden into George Bush! (0.00 / 0)
John McCain may like to say he wants to follow Osama bin Laden to the gates of Hell, but so far all he's done is follow George Bush into a misguided war in Iraq.
-Barck Obama

This morphing was not done by a PR staffer designing a TV spot, these words came out of Barack Obama's mouth!

Yes, it's a stupid argument. But less stupid than the argument that all Republicans should be denounced because of a TV spot that had both Max Cleland and Osama bin Laden. That has led to 5 years of left-wing outrage??!??


Slighty OT, but I just noticed... (0.00 / 0)
... that John McCain is using essentially the same campaign slogan as Hillary Clinton on his website:

READ TO LEAD ON DAY ONE

I guess since Mark Penn's partner is atop the McCain campaign, I shouldn't be surprised.

"Liberals feel unworthy of their possessions. Conservatives feel they deserve everything they’ve stolen." -- Mort Sahl


Nevertheless, (0.00 / 0)
Obama succeeded in ridiculing McCain's pig-headed position.  Obama should use the opportunity to discuss how our real enemy is ensconsed in Pakistan and Afghanistan (and Europe and North Africa, etc.), and how diversion of resources to Iraq has weakened our overall effort.

Is McCain in the habit... (0.00 / 0)
... of saying "Democrat" instead of the proper "Democratic"?

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