First March 4th Results Thread

by: Chris Bowers

Tue Mar 04, 2008 at 19:01


Second Results thread here. States with winners are in bold. Updates will appear below the tables. New threads will be created when the comment load becomes too high. All times are eastern. Entering the night, my count shows Obama with 1,194.5 pledged delegates,a and Clinton with 1,033.5

March 4th Primary and Caucus Results
State Reporting Obama % Clinton % Delegates Obama Del Clinton Del
Ohio 31% 41% 57% 141 32 28
Rhode Island 38% 38% 61% 21 6 6
Texas Primary 12% 50% 48% 126 18 14
Texas Caucus 0% -- -- 67 0 0
Vermont 67% 60% 38% 15 9 6
Total NA NA NA 370 65 54

Update 9: Second results thread here.

Update 8--Ohio Delegate Thoughts: Clinton is putting up a pretty big margin in some of these early returns. However, in many of congressional districts where she is putting up the margin, a 20% victory is actually not quite enough to earn the key 3-1 delegate splits. Rather, she needed 62.51% of the two-candidate vote or more in order to pull that off. The delegate math in Ohio seems to be helping Obama, despite Clinton's overall popular advantage.

Update 7--Clinton Wins Rhode Island: CBS, CNN and NBC all call Rhode Island for Clinton. It has been a long time since she won a primary, but she has finally done it again. I imagine Ohio can't be too far behind. Texas still looks like the biggest contest of the night.

Update 6--McCain Clinches Republican Nomination: Not much suspense, but John McCain has clinched the Republican nomination. Howard Dean's statement:

"John McCain is out of touch with the issues facing Americans each day.  Instead of offering solutions to the high cost of health care, help for the middle class or ideas to create jobs, McCain offers 100 years in Iraq and more of the same Bush budgets that have heaped debt onto our children and damaged our economy.  Instead of ending the influence of lobbyists in Washington, he's hired them to run his campaign.  The closer voters look at the real McCain record, the more they will realize he cannot be trusted to deliver the change America wants."

Go Howard!

Update 5--Texas and Rhode Island Exit Polls: Exit polls for Texas and Rhode Island are now available. Quick math for Rhode Island shows Clinton 51.6%--47.5% Obama. In Texas, quick math shows Clinton 50.0%--48.6% Obama. Importantly, that actually means Obama looks to be slightly favored in Texas, given his 88,000 margin among the nearly 1,000,000 early voters.

Update 4--Clinton closing gap in Texas: Clinton is continually closing the gap in Texas. Still, with nearly one million votes counted, Obama leads by 88,000.

Update 3--Obama jumps out to huge lead in Texas: It would appear that Obama dominated early voting in Texas. With  over 750,000 850,000 votes already in, Obama holds a huge advantage of 17% 13%, or about 130,000 votes 110,000. Functionally, it means that Clinton must win on Election Day by 4-5% just to tie Obama in Texas. This is a huge boost for Obama's chances to win the night on delegates, and possibly even to knock Clinton out of the campaign.

Update 2--Ohio polls close: Exit poll can be found here. At first glance, it indicates a narrow Clinton victory, 51%-48%. That sort of victory won't net many pledged delegates. Also, some Ohio polls might be open until 8:30 p.m. because of bad weather.

Update--Obama wins Vermont. Exit poll can be found here. Looks like a huge Obama blowout, with back of the envelope math showing Obama 62%-37% Clinton. If Obama wins 65.01% or more of the two-candidate vote, he wins the delegate count 10-5. If Obama wins between 55.01% and 64.99% of the two candidate vote, he wins the delegates 9-6. At least I think that is how it works.  

Chris Bowers :: First March 4th Results Thread

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Obama wins VT (0.00 / 0)
CNN and MSNBC call it. Should be a 2-1 victory.

Iraq was a big issue in VT, propelling Obama to a big win.


Vermont Allocation (0.00 / 0)
My understanding is that 10 get pledged at the district level and then the district delegates elect 2 PLEOs and 3 at-large, with only the latter being proportional.

Wouldn't that mean that the PLEOs would both go for Obama or do the pledged delegates only get one vote for PLEOs (meaning the 3-4 Clinton delegates would choose the runner-up)?

A vote against Health Care Reform is a vote for ten 9/11s every single year!


... (4.00 / 3)
Those are the questions that haunt my nightmares. Whichever way is the most complicated is probably how they will do it.

"Don't hate the media, become the media" -Jello Biafra

[ Parent ]
PLEO (0.00 / 0)
The Vermont delegation would split as follows:

10 "district" level -- either 6-4 or 7-3 Obama
3 "at-large"  -- 2 -1  Obama
2 "PLEO" -- 1 -1 Obama/Clinton split

The PLEO's are allocated based on the primary results

In addition, the delegates will elect an "unpledged party leader/elected official" in June -- since Obama will control the delegation, that should be an Obama person


[ Parent ]
100K People (0.00 / 0)
This is a bit off topic, but watching MSNBC did anyone else notice that awful commercial for "100K+ jobs and 100K+ people"?  God, that's disgusting!

I noticed it. (0.00 / 0)
It's tacky.

[ Parent ]
This could be a bellwether for Obama. (0.00 / 0)
If his margin decreased markedly from expectations it wouldn't look very good for him. So far he seems about where he was expected to be (low-60s), which means he might be holding his own in later contests.

Or not. We shall see what we shall see.


Ohio too close to call (0.00 / 0)
No surprise there. Could be a late night for Ohio results.  

msnbc says 64% for 10-5 split (0.00 / 0)


[ Parent ]
Ohio (0.00 / 0)
Ohio looks like Obama wins men by 5 but Clinton wins women by 9.


Ohio breakdowns to... (0.00 / 0)
According to the exit polls you linked to, it'll be Clinton 51, Obama 49. But keep in mind this does not include any early voting.

Looks like we won't know the results for several hours.


good point (0.00 / 0)
Yeah I was wondering how the early voting factors into this. Since the early voting was taking place when Obama was surging, the exit polls showing a very tight race among voters who turned out today could foreshadow an Obama win.

[ Parent ]
May i spin this ? (4.00 / 1)
I will keep saying it all night. That she would only win Ohio by two or three points after Obama's horrible three last news cycle is STUNNING.

Good point... (4.00 / 1)
I was going into tonight expecting at least 5+ point wins for Clinton in OH and TX.  If it ends up this close after the ridiculous pounding Obama has taken recently, why... let me see if I can use a quote from Clinton here... "that would raise serious concerns about her candidacy."

[ Parent ]
SDs (0.00 / 0)
If Brokaw is right and Obama has 50 SDs in the wings, that was a BRILLIANT move to hold them until after the results of tonight.  If he splits the bigs, its a knife in her back.  If she wins both, then it might help the media brunt.

And.. (0.00 / 0)
And he is poised to drop his ungodly fundraising amounts from February. Perhaps he is going in for the kill. Maybe Obama's got some killer instincts afterall.  

"Don't hate the media, become the media" -Jello Biafra

[ Parent ]
the fundraising anvil (0.00 / 0)
has been looming all month since they snickered at Clinton's fundraising at the beginning of Feb. One has got to imagine they are going to blow the doors off. Gotta be well past 50M. This speculating without a shred of evidence is all I have left to keep me entertained in this. :)

Michael Bloomberg, prince of corporate welfare

[ Parent ]
exit polls (0.00 / 0)
do the exit polls take into account early voters?

Nope (0.00 / 0)
Just the people who show up on election day to vote.

[ Parent ]
thanks (0.00 / 0)
do you think that helps or hurts Obama in Ohio?  I heard somewhere (MSNBC i think) that Obama might have an edge in early voting.

[ Parent ]
No one knows for sure (4.00 / 2)
But if one candidate outperforms the exit polls, then that candidate probably did better in early voting.  

[ Parent ]
Recommended (0.00 / 0)
For being tonight's most obvious statement. :)

[ Parent ]
I have no idea (0.00 / 0)
Polls in TX and OH were all over the place (and with huge margins of error) on who was favored in early voting. Clinton was ahead in the states during most of the early voting period, but Obama had momentum nationally and has a better ground game.

So...who knows?


[ Parent ]
Texas Results (0.00 / 0)
CNN has results from Texas coming in from the areas that closed at 8pm EST.

So far Obama 58, Clinton 41 with about 65,000 votes in.


thanks, I didn't know where the #s came from (0.00 / 0)
It seemed odd to have 250,000 votes with 0% reporting.

Yeah I blog.

[ Parent ]
CNN.com has about 250,000 TX votes counted w/0% rep. (0.00 / 0)
Did they release early voting results or what?

Yeah I blog.

They've got hard numbers (0.00 / 0)
on Fox. The primaries for parts of the state are done and have moved into the caucus phase. That's why we're seeing some primary numbers on Fox. On Fox news (sorry), the earliest numbers had Obama significantly up.

[ Parent ]
Here are TX #s from abc (0.00 / 0)
[ Parent ]
These Early Texas Numbers Don't Make Sense. (0.00 / 0)
MSNCB shows 1% of the vote as 489,023 for Obama and 374,383 for Clinton.  That means that there will be over 83 million Democrats voting in the Texas Primary.  Something doesn't add up.  

[ Parent ]
the 1% (0.00 / 0)
is probably precincts and not percentage of total voting population--not sure if they are counting the early votes as a single precinct or just included them with the 1% of precincts reporting

[ Parent ]
Heard it here first (0.00 / 0)
women were over sampled. Obama wins Ohio.  

Source (0.00 / 0)
source would be right from my butt.

Doesn't 59% women voters seem about 4 or 5 percentage points higher than anyone expected.


[ Parent ]
No (0.00 / 0)
Its been 60-40 in most states.

[ Parent ]
cripe (0.00 / 0)
I'm learning .... hold out hope for me.

[ Parent ]
Question (0.00 / 0)
Could someone explain how on earth 750,000 votes are in, but CNN et al. say less than 1% has reported in Texas?

Also ... is it just me, or have the Ohio results been stalled for an hour now?  Any news here?


Ohio has been officially (0.00 / 0)
delayed until all polls close; a few locations were allowed to stay open later due to weather and/or insufficient ballot supply.

TX seems to be early voter calculations plus possibly some early primary returns.


[ Parent ]
re question (0.00 / 0)
1% of precincts?  Maybe the early votes are lumped together as a single "precinct"?

[ Parent ]
early votes (0.00 / 0)
ah, guess the early votes are included.  but what's going on in OH?

[ Parent ]
ohio Clinton/Obama columns switched (0.00 / 0)
It looks like the Obama/Clinton columns for Ohio on delegate count are switched.

NoSlaves.com  


The Economic Populist


No, they are not (0.00 / 0)
check CBSnews.com, which is where I am getting my numbers.  

[ Parent ]
ok (0.00 / 0)
but unless I'm missing something, such as by district/county,  if they are doing real time assignments based on percentages something is wrong on it.

NoSlaves.com  


The Economic Populist


[ Parent ]
Hmm, could early votes only be partially in? (0.00 / 0)
If you look at the map of TX on CNN, they have results for several counties, including Obama strongholds, with "0%" reporting, but then no results for big swaths of the state.  It's possible those early vote numbers haven't come in yet, so the "early vote" numbers as they are now are skewed.

I hope I'm wrong... guess we'll see.


How many votes expected in TX? (0.00 / 0)
I realize it's a big state, but anyone know what kind of numbers we're looking at for totals in TX?  Supposedly the "early voting" may have made up about 60% of the vote, but I don't know what kind of numbers that represents.

I would estimate (0.00 / 0)
About 2.75 million.  

[ Parent ]
Hmm... (0.00 / 0)
So that 80k could probably be easily made up in the next 1.75 million votes. =)

[ Parent ]
Cough (0.00 / 0)
Considering Austin hasn't even started reporting, I wouldn't bet on it :)
Although I wouldn't bet on the other way around either  

[ Parent ]
Hey, I hope so... (0.00 / 0)
So far my predictions at Mydd are looking remarkably accurate...  I predicted:

Obama by 20 in VT
Obama by 8 in TX
Clinton by 4 in OH
Clinton by 5 in RI

Do I win anything if it turns out this way? ;)


[ Parent ]
Yup (0.00 / 0)
You win Obama as the Democratic nominee.

[ Parent ]
Woohoo! (0.00 / 0)
That'd be just fine with me. =)

[ Parent ]
ABC reports 960k Texas Democratic votes so far (0.00 / 0)
The ABC Texas page -- still 1% reporting.

Obama    524,816 54%
Clinton   439,978 45%

If the Democratic vote totals 2.75m, Obama has a 9% lead with 35% of the votes reported.


[ Parent ]
3.6m to 3.8m predicted (0.00 / 0)
via dKos --

http://www.dailykos.com/storyo...

An Obama source emails First Read that the campaign is expecting turnout between 3.6 to 3.8 million in the Texas Democratic primary.

Consider that John Kerry received 2.8 million votes in the Lone Star State in the 2004 general election.

"That's a lot of 'new' Democratic voters," the Obama source says. "Will be great for Texas Dem Party that's working to rebuild and only needs to pick up four seats to take back the state house."

Obama  527,381 54% 0
Clinton   444,149 45% 0

If there are 3.8m votes in Dem primary, that means Obama leads by 9% with 25% reporting.


[ Parent ]
Total vote vs early vote (0.00 / 0)
Is this total # of voters based on estimate that 25% of Texas primary voters voted in early voting?  Looks like it....

[ Parent ]
Texas, Rhode Island too close to call (0.00 / 0)
via MSNBC. No surprise there.

Ohio also still too close to call.


Crunching the RI numbers (0.00 / 0)
If the CBS exit polls are accurate, Clinton will win 51.5 to 47.5.

I'm not touching the Texas exit poll numbers, as they don't include early voting.


Wow (0.00 / 0)
I'm not sure how you guys get those but if so, that may be big for Obama.  Any ideas on Ohio?

[ Parent ]
Ohio Exits On CNN (0.00 / 0)
The exits on CNN indicate that the split is Clinton 51--48 Obama in Ohio.  But I've looked at a lot of early exit polling numbers this primary season and they are horrifically inaccurate at predicting the final result.  On Super Tuesday, for example, early exit polling in Arkansas was off by 19 points and in Massachusetts it was off by 16 points.  

[ Parent ]
But Just For Kicks (0.00 / 0)
The Texas Exits show Clinton 50--49 Obama.  Without the early voting included and the poor predictive nature of exit polling, Texas is up for grabs.  

[ Parent ]
MUCH closer than expected in RI (0.00 / 0)
I wonder what happened.  Wasn't Clinton dominating by high double digits in this heavily Catholic, northeastern, working-class state?

Could big a decent plus for Obama in the delegate fight.


[ Parent ]
Poor Exit Polling Happened (4.00 / 1)
With 14% of the vote counted in Rhode Island, Clinton has a 14 point lead.  If you look at the county reporting breakdowns on CNN, more votes have been counted in areas where Obama is running well, so based on this, we might expect Clinton's lead to grow as the night goes on.  

[ Parent ]
Nothing to see here, folks. (0.00 / 0)
Obama slightly outperforms the polling. Clinton's small OH win is barely enough to keep her in the race without embarrassment. It's still Obama's nomination to lose, and we're still not quite done yet.  

MSNBC calls one more for Clinton (0.00 / 0)
Olbermann just said Clinton wins Rhode Island.

Ok (0.00 / 0)
Obama is down over 20 points in Ohio with 5% in.  Anyone have anything comforting for Obama supporters there?

Rural (4.00 / 1)
Rural Clinton-friendly report before urban areas which have more votes to count and more Obama supporters

[ Parent ]
Look at the state map (4.00 / 1)
Scroll down to the bottom. No results from Cleveland, Columbus, Toledo, and Cincinnati.

Patience. Jim Webb was down in VA until 97% were in.  


[ Parent ]
Nothing in from Cleveland or Columbus... (4.00 / 1)
I'm unsure of who's favored where, but I think Obama is typically favored in the bigger cities... Cleveland in particular because of it's black population, if I'm not mistaken.

This will probably end up looking like MO... Will seem like a wipeout at first for Obama, but big margins coming in from the slowest to report areas (the big cities) will have him start closing the deal.


[ Parent ]
Thanks (0.00 / 0)
I basically knew this, but the tension of these primaries is killing me.  Had to post something

[ Parent ]
Poles Are Open Late In Cuyahoga County (0.00 / 0)
A judge ordered poles to stay open late in Cuyahoga County, which is where Cleveland is located.  That means that the results there will probably come in very late.  

[ Parent ]
Michael Barone (0.00 / 0)
on Fox reviewed some early counties in Ohio - Clinton is running better than she did in Wisconsin - enough to run even, but not ahead.

I respect Barone on number counting like this: he was very accurate on the Webb race in  Virginia and on Florida in 2000.  

Ohio looks very close - and that is nothing but good news for Obama.


With 16% in (0.00 / 0)
And Obama down 18%, 64K votes?  

I don't know - seems like it will close up a lot, but it's Clinton's, it's simply a matter of how much.


[ Parent ]
Ohio (0.00 / 0)
is about the country vrs the city.

Nothing yet from Cleveland or Columbus.

There is a long way to go yet.


[ Parent ]
Guess so (0.00 / 0)
But it's now 90K spread. So far, the numbers have all gone in one direction.

[ Parent ]
C +120k (0.00 / 0)
MSNBC, 35% reporting

seems like a lot... how much will it come down?

"I think the economic logic behind dumping a load of toxic waste in the lowest wage country is impeccable and we should face up to that."
-Lawrence Summers


[ Parent ]
Howard Fineman: Breaks within the Clinton campaign (0.00 / 0)
He's on MSNBC right now, saying that top people in the Clinton campaign believe that "Ohio isn't enough" and are reluctant to continue if she wins only Ohio and Rhode Island. A type of "grim determination" at the Clinton camp, he says.

Keep watching the huge early voting number shrink in TX (0.00 / 0)
Shrink, shrink, shrink...like a countdown clock.

Yes, but doesn't seem like today's votes in big cities are in yet... (0.00 / 0)
Austin, Dallas, and Houston are still showing up at 0%... theoretically if that means they haven't sent in today's results yet, Obama's numbers should improve again once they start coming in.

[ Parent ]
Exactly (0.00 / 0)
She is bound to take the lead in the middle there but Austin and Houston should sweep back in.
Just like Ohio. Remember MO !

[ Parent ]
Hope so! (0.00 / 0)
Interestingly, with the big spread of OH, Clinton is, as of this moment, ahead in popular vote.  

This will change soon, of course.


[ Parent ]
The gap is down to 40K (0.00 / 0)
Any bets on the count evening up, BEFORE Obama starts leading again?

[ Parent ]
Watch Cuyahoga, Hamilton and... (0.00 / 0)
.... Franklin County numbers.

To win Ohio, Obama needs 60% in Cuyahoga and Franklin. He also needs 55% in Hamilton.


I would think (0.00 / 0)
60% should be more than doable in Cuyahoga.  I wonder about Franklin.  

[ Parent ]
CNN's exit polling (0.00 / 0)
shows 59% Obama in Cuyahoga.  Of course, we have to wait and see what kind of electoral irregularities crop up there.

The good thing is Cuyahoga went to paper ballots.  The bad thing is they waited till pretty much the last minute possible to make the switch.  Which means confusion, I think.

Actually, exit polling shows Obama eeking out wins in every region that CNN broke the state into except for Northeast Ohio.

Central, Northwest, and Southwest went Obama 51 to 55%

Are there that many votes in Non-Cuyahoga northeast Ohio for Clinton to win?  They've got her at 61% there.  

What is that?  Suburban Cleveland, Akron, and Youngstown?

35% of the sample was from the Northeast.  Is that a fair share?  Seems really high, given the size of Columbus (Central) and Cincinnati (Southeast) and Toledo (Northwest) and Dayton (Southeast).  


[ Parent ]
Barone (0.00 / 0)
was specifically looking at suburb precincts.


[ Parent ]
also (0.00 / 0)
is only 19% black an accurate figure for Ohio?  (Democrats plus Independents)


[ Parent ]
Early Voting and Some Context (0.00 / 0)
Does anyone know whether ALL the early votes have been included in the initial Texas reports (i.e., 0% precincts reporting)?

For information, Northwest Texas (which shows lots of counties with Clinton majorities) is included in three super-Republican Congressional Districts -- TX-11, TX-13, TX-19. Each of these three Congressional Districts voted for Dubya in 2004 by 78-22%. These districts include all the area of West Texas north of the Rio Grande Valley (Valley is the area where cable pundits are describing as Clinton's Latino strength), through all of the panhandle, and east to a line running from Fort Worth down through the western suburbs of Austin and San Antonio.

The counties out there appear to have fewer than five hundred Democratic primary votes per county.  Clinton is NOT going to run up any large numerical leads in these thre Northwest Texas Congressional Districts.

For further information, 2004 Democratic presidential primary vote was a little below 840,000.  It appears that the early votes this year in the Democratic primary have exceeded the entire vote in the 2004 presidential primary in Texas.

(I don't have a cyberlink, but the information above comes from the 2008 edition of the Almanac of American Politics.)  


MSMBC Says Harris County Early Voting Not In (0.00 / 0)
Harris Country, where Houston is located, is the only county in Texas that has not reported its early voting.  That obviously favors Obama.  

[ Parent ]
While listening to returns... (0.00 / 0)
I was browsing and found this recent quote from Obama. It is awesome - in a very freaky way:

He is admonishing parents:

"Turn off the TV set, put the video game away. Buy a little desk or put that child at the kitchen table. Watch them do their homework. If they don't know how to do it, give them help. If you don't know how to do it, call the teacher. Make them go to bed at a reasonable time. Keep them off the streets. Give them some breakfast. Come on! And since I'm on a roll, if you're child misbehaves in school, don't cuss out the teacher! Do something with your child!"

Obama has to have the fattest head and ego I have heard.
Huckabee is a populist next to this guy.

Who the hell is he to tell me when my child should go to sleep?
My child has also learned from video games.
And I certainly resent his message about disciplining a child.
He sounds like an old fart.

It makes me angry.

But the content is also so stupid.

Does he think he's some asshole tv evangelist?


Maybe you rock as a parent ... (0.00 / 0)
... but some don't.

As an educator, I have to say I have no problem whatsoever with what he says.  Who is he to tell you when to put your child to sleep?  Good question.  But what should I say to the parent who lets their 6-year-old stay up until 11pm, and then that kid doesn't learn anything because they're horrifically overtired and falling asleep in school, and who then (of course) blames the teacher and the school system because their child isn't learning?

Listen, it the shoe doesn't fit, don't wear it, but unless you work with children on a regular basis,  don't be too indignant at his words.  Talk to some teachers or social workers and see what they think about them.  Most will tell you that the majority of parents are doing a fine job, and that some parents make some really poor decisions when it comes to their kids, and then blame everyone else for the kids' resulting struggles.

Republicans can't fix our country; they're too busy saddlebacking.


[ Parent ]
Nope.... (4.00 / 1)
..........he knows he is 'The One' and if you hang around here saying stuff like this his legions of brain-washed, cult-of-personality followers will disabuse you of the quaint ideas you have about personal freedom.

Fascism is approaching us form both the left and the right.

Both relying on the built in splits in society dividing us into many tribes of 'other' in order to marginalize and demonize us.

Obama's appeal to McCain voters ought to indicate something to worry about. But no....

I have my instructions.

Shut up and sing!

Shut up and sing!

Peace, Health and Prosperity for Everyone.


[ Parent ]
Think (0.00 / 0)
You are so busy reacting you haven't given the impression you've been thinking for a while, now.  I know you can do better.

[ Parent ]
Yes....I know.... (0.00 / 0)
......hard to accept the facts. That we are on our way to nominating the least progressive of our two possible choices and that that nominee is so deeply flawed that he gives McCain a chance.

Aside from his rather autocratic take on being a Democrat. Aside from his being a died-in-the-wool Liebercrat. Aside from his intention ot 'compromise' the nation into corporate slavery, which he doesn't think is such a big deal when it was merely racial. Read his book if you think otherwise.

Yep....I'm sooooo clueless.

.....both candidates 'Chips are Down' Ratings:

Obama: 76.87 ranked 41st

Clinton: 86.90 ranked 27th

The following Senators ranked ahead of Obama:

Webb, Salazar, Feinstein, and, yes, Nelson.

                        ---------------ACtitizen Mar 3, 2008

Less progressive than Nelso....Whoeeeeeeeeeeeeeee!

Peace, Health and Prosperity for Everyone.


[ Parent ]
Hey, Look! (0.00 / 0)
Hey, you actually made something close to an actual argument!  See, I told you that you could do better.  Amazing what a little motivation can do.  You didn't actually link to anything, but you certainly give the impression that facts were involved.  But heck, just plain ol' opinion would be fine as well.  Most of the time you just...

...don't actually say anything.

You need to add a link, but even without one this post earns a C+.  Keep it up!


[ Parent ]
Go home troll (0.00 / 1)
Take your b---s--- over to RedState, please.

On the merits, Obama was echoing the "parental responsibility" theme -- which is a good theme, IF the parents have sufficient resources.  It also speaks to African-Americans who have middle-class values, who turn out most heavily in the African American voting population.


[ Parent ]
You, sir.... (0.00 / 0)

..........are the damn Troll here. Any commenter has the right to comment on the statements of candidates and even other commenter's. That's part of our political dialogue through which we attempt to educate each other.

You seem to realize that what you are advocating, the suppression of other voices, does belong at RedState.

I agree and suggest you haul yourself over there.

You'll fit right in.

Peace, Health and Prosperity for Everyone.


[ Parent ]
Are you serious? (0.00 / 0)
I only have the text to go on, so I didn't hear it or see it, but I don't understand why this makes you angry.

[ Parent ]
Because (4.00 / 1)
It makes me angry because he is not supposed to be lecturing parents.

His picture of the homework at the kitchen table is Ozzie and Harriet.

It's the arrogance of a particular class mentality.



[ Parent ]
Early Voting in Texas (0.00 / 0)
Chuck Todd on MSNBC says that Clinton had a 4,000 vote lead in Texas in early voting, but that Harris County (where Houston is located) is the only county in Texas not to report its early voting numbers.  

Cuyahoga County Vote Will Not Be Counted Until 430AM (0.00 / 0)
According to MSNBC.  It could be a long night!

So let's say (0.00 / 0)
So let's say (if this is even possible) that Clinton gets more votes in Ohio but Obama gets more delegates. How does that get communicated by the press?

NBC called Ohio for Clinton (0.00 / 0)
just now, saw it on MSNBC

Clinton's 'base' came through huge (0.00 / 0)
2 out of 3 Hispanics.
White women
A shift back in white men, to Hilary.

An uncomfortable question here:

a. Obama's base - really "us", the progressive party - if he MUST have a choice between Hilary and McCain, we will choice Hilary.

b.  But, given the MAKEUP of Hilary's base - more traditional, lower income, Hispanics, older - I think from an identity standpoint, in a Obama-McCain matchup, you'll see Hillary's base be much less - loyal.  A lot more percentage of defects to McCain.

Because of the delegate count, I doubt it matters - Hillary can't make up the ground.

Still, a scary prospect, for me personally.


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