Where the WVWV Debate Will Go

by: Matt Stoller

Thu May 01, 2008 at 16:07


Well, the Obama campaign agrees with its supporters and the Southern Studies Institute that this looks like voter suppression.  
Matt Stoller :: Where the WVWV Debate Will Go
Bob Bauer, an attorney for Democratic presidential candidate Barack Obama's campaign, said the calls were "extremely disturbing" and fit "the classic model of voter suppression" by sowing confusion just before the May 6 primary.

But he stopped short of saying the calls were designed to discourage voters.

"They have said it's inadvertent, and I understand it will not happen again," he said.

A Presidential campaign essentially accused a major progressive group, Women's Voices Women's Vote, of trying to suppress its voters.  I'll let WVWV, the Obama campaign, and the Southern Studies Institute take it from here, I think my part in this conversation is over for now.  Here's Color of Change:

There have been clear errors in planning and execution on the part of Women's Voices Women's Votes, and those errors have led to a situation where Black voters in North Carolina may be dissuaded from voting in a hotly contested and important primary election.  This is a major problem and point of concern.  To continue in the important role they've played in past elections, Women's Voices Women's Votes must fix the damage done and prevent it from happening in the future--working to restore the faith of the community protecting access to the vote by all people.  It is essential that groups doing voter registration operate within the law and that they ensure that they do not confuse voters in to the process of doing their work.

At the same time, the accusations that the errors made by Women's Voices Women's Votes are part of a conspiracy to help Senator Clinton, appear to be false and reckless.  Women's Voices Women's Votes has a history of registering voters of color, and the facts as we understand them, simply don't point to such a conspiracy.  As Women's Voices Women's Votes takes deserved heat for whatever damage they've caused, it's not productive for them to be unfairly maligned as working to harm or help one of the presidential primary candidates.

As an organization that is tirelessly fighting voter suppression in the Black community where a history of disenfranchisement necessitates a raised level of scrutiny, we must take any accusations seriously, but in doing so rely on the facts.

This sounds right to me.  If anyone was offended at my tone, my apologies.  Wrong week to stop sniffing glue and all that...

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Where the WVWV Debate Will Go | 21 comments
I wonder (4.00 / 1)
How long before I am accussed as being part of this conspriacy. It wouldn't be the first time I've been accused as being part of a vast, evil conspriacy by other bloggers.

It is actually kind of scary. WVWV needs to make things right, but the speed with which conspiratorial accusations fly around  is pretty disturbing.  

Why can't we just stop talking about the primary for a week? (4.00 / 2)
This is getting really ugly.  

Can't the blogosphere (or at least this site) take a break, work on something constructive, and just not post about Clinton's or Obama's campaign for a few days?

We have a lot of work to do, right now, and we are not doing it.

[ Parent ]
check (4.00 / 1)
Maybe I'll give that a shot.
[ Parent ]
Ugh (4.00 / 1)
Well, at least all WVWV, all the time is marginally better than the previous all Obama-on-Fox, all the time or the brief break of Matt whining about whining in between. Maybe it is time for everyone to take a little break.
[ Parent ]
Now that you mention it... (0.00 / 0)
Maybe it's time to look at the Bush Dogs again.

John McCain thinks we haven't spent enough time in Iraq
[ Parent ]
maybe (4.00 / 4)
you should not give a shit about being accused of it, and just start addressing the people who are reasonable, rational, intelligent, etc.  

It is obvious that a lot of commenters/readers of OL fall into the second group and by constantly getting frustrated with the ones pushing your buttons you are just feeding them instead of feeding us.....with good, rational, fact-filled dialogue.  OL has a good rep and great discussions for the most part, just keep that going and try not to pay attention to the bullshit.

Thanks

[ Parent ]
You're misinterpreting Bauer (4.00 / 2)
He basically said that these calls may have had the effect of suppressing voters.  That's a very different thing from claiming that WVWV was "trying" to do that.  Bauer himself believes that it was "inadvertent".  
no (0.00 / 0)
Bauer said clearly that the calls 'fit the classic model of voter suppression', that the calls were 'extremely disturbing', and then he said that WVWV said they were inadvertent, not that he himself believed they were inadvertent.
[ Parent ]
OK (4.00 / 1)
But he didn't claim that WVWV was intentionally trying to suppress voters.  And FWIW, many Obama supporters have not gone that far either.
[ Parent ]
Well ... (4.00 / 4)
... here's the fullest quotes I can find.  Via Ben Smith:
"The group has apologized and indicated that it was inadvertent," said Obama campaign counsel Bob Bauer, adding that the apology is "presumably to be taken at face value."
Via the News & Observer:
In a conference call with reporters this afternoon, legal counsel Bob Bauer said that recent robocalls by Women's Voices Women Vote to North Carolina voters fit "the classic model of voter suppression" by introducing confusion just before an election.

But he stopped short of saying that the calls were designed to suppress votes, noting that the group said that the calls were not meant to be misleading.

"They have said it's inadvertent and I understand it will not happen again," he said.

He said the group has pledged to cooperate with state regulators and apologized for the mistakes, so the Obama campaign does not see any reason to push for legal action.


[ Parent ]
seems quite plausable that the Obama camp is just a little on edge (4.00 / 1)
and maybe reacting a little tersely under the circumstances. I think its fair to say they are being overly curt about it, but this does effect their base voters in a state critical to their survival only 5 days before the vote. under the circumstances its not surprising they might sound really pissed off about it and not want to be all that forgiving immediately.

I have the feeling Matt that you just kind of have it in for Obama this week and there's just not much room for having some perspective on why they might have reacted this way. Because the other conclusion is something along the lines of believing the Obama campaign wants to tear down all grassroots organizations and have everything managed from within their campaign, and that just isn't plausible.

I agree that would be good for ol.c to maybe take a week off from talking about the primary (or until May 6 anyway). Maybe we can have from now to Tuesday a focus on pushing McCrazy stories or going after Chuck Schumer and his support of Blue Dogs or highlight some candidates we should know about or something.

Michael Bloomberg, prince of corporate welfare

[ Parent ]
Down with Very Serious Bloggers, Up with Stoller (4.00 / 2)
THanks for posting this, Matt.  As bloggers get more and more integrated into the DC/consultant world, it's really important that they don't become its knee-jerk defenders.

WVWV, while likely not malicious in its actions, certainly raised some very serious questions that deserve answers ... not Very Serious Bloggers telling everyone they're part of a mob.

Thanks.


we have a hostile environment (0.00 / 0)
Matt and Chris as leaders, and many of us, myself included, have lately contributed to an environment where these exaggerated hair-trigger reactions can happen.  I don't want to get into further debate over Obama on Fox, but regardless of opinion, there was an extremity to the discussion that makes this latest flap inevitable.

The Hillary/Obama slugfests have degenerated, with nothing new being said.

People are on edge, with the campaign dragging on far too long and both Obama and Hillary taking hits.  It impacts all of us.

In many ways, the die is cast.  OpenLeft has always been the smartest blog on the blogosphere, we do what isn't being done.  On the eventual nominee, we have minimal impact.  I say this as someone who has very strong opinions as to who that should be.

Where we can have an impact is in healing the gaping wounds that I see on this site as well as elsewhere.  That doesn't entail getting all patty-cake.  But it does entail getting smarter.

Full Court Press!  http://www.openleft.com/showDi...

cover up (0.00 / 0)
Matt, in light of the press release oddness going on in NC and Colorado, and given the fact that your ColorOfChange.org quote isn't on their actual website, it seems to me that there's an orchestrated campaign going on by WVWV to clear their good name.  BEFORE any investigation has taken place by either the NC Attorney General, the NC Board of Elections, or the WVWV board.

Can you find out from the ColorOfChange guy whether he was solicited to make this statement, what specific steps he think should take place in order for WVWV to "fix" what they've done, when those steps should happen, and whether he has any better information than we do about why the suspicions about voter suppression seem to be "false" - given the previous warning in Virginia, the promise to rectify things, and the obvious slip-shoddiness of the whole operation?  Or is he just taking their word?

I can't believe (0.00 / 0)
that they would have the effrontery to try to clear their name.  Horrors.  They must be guilty.
[ Parent ]
almost (4.00 / 2)
I understand trying to clear one's name, but they seem to be putting out surrogates, for lack of a better term, to VOUCH for their good name rather than actually clear anything up.  "There must be a reasonable answer, there's NO WAY these people would do something so nefarious" is the common refrain.

Well, that's fine.  But the fact that they made the same "mistake" TWICE this year, after promising not to do it, and both times they had the appearance of voter suppression or voter confusion means that we have the responsibility to be skeptical.  Once - fine.  Twice - not so fine.

So all I'm asking is - did WVWV solicit this statement from ColorOfChange and, if so, did they provide any additional information to them to demonstrate that it might actually be a false charge.  Did they explain why they didn't clean up their act after Virginia?

And why on earth are they sending out press releases after this scandal had broken that LOOK like they're trying to cover their ass on this, if this was all such a simple misunderstanding?  

[ Parent ]
Who accused them of these mistakes in other states? (0.00 / 0)
Republican or Democratic offie holders....I think it matters a lot ....If it was a Republican official then I think what we saw was another attempt by the Republican party to find voter fraud in order to continue to justify their genuine voter suppression efforts.

Maybe Matt and Chris are reacting to the immediate suspicion of a group that has only done good work in terms of registering more voters who will vote for Democrats.

Too much is seen through a partisan candidate lens and that's distorting of the process.

That suspicion has given the Republican party a gift to use in its the attempt to pass more voter suppression laws like the Supreme Court just upheld.

 

"Incrementalism isn't a different path to the same place, it could be a different path to a different place"
Stoller

[ Parent ]
Roy Cooper is a Democrat (4.00 / 1)
He's the NC Attorney General.

If WVWV wasn't so stupid (or worse), they wouldn't have given the Republican Party this issue on a platter.

[ Parent ]
no (0.00 / 0)
I put up the CoC release because it was emailed to me.  If you think I'm lying about something as easily fack checked as that, go somewhere else.  As for CoC, they are an independent group.
[ Parent ]
no to what, Matt? (0.00 / 0)
I certainly don't think you're lying!!  I'm just asking WHY the CoC guy sent this release out?  Was it at the request of WVWV?  If not, that's cool, but if it's part of an orchestrated PR campaign by WVWV to put a progressive face, from trusted progressives and other people of color out there BEFORE most of the questions are answered about these robocalls, that's kind of messed up.

But I absolutely believe you are not lying!!

[ Parent ]
one more thing (0.00 / 0)
Finally, we get to the unbelievably vicious attacks on Women's Voices Women's Vote.  Why pretend like they operate in bad faith?  This is a progressive organization that registers voters, something very few of us know anything about doing on a large scale level because there just isn't very much of it happening.  WVWV does it systematically, they do it aggressively, and they did it when no one else would, in 2004 or 2006.  Do you think it's glamorous to register voters or something?  Do you think lots of people come up to you and say 'great job registering millions of voters in 2004', or nice job on that voter registration campaign in Ohio, you really empowered a lot of poor women?  Do you think you get 15% of a multi-million dollar TV budget to register voters?  Of course not.  It's hard, difficult, boring fucking work that no other progressive group would do.  But of course it's easy to go after these people and pretend like there's some nefarious Clinton-spawned plot when several of the board members, including Mike Lux who has posted here for months, are well-known Obama supporters, and the organization relies on academics and data-driven methods.

Matt, just to let you know, there are DOZENS of progressive organizations out there who were doing voter registration "when no one else would."  Just ask Mike Lux.

Yes, some people were attacking WVWV before knowing all the facts. This included the NC Attorney General, which stated without equivocation that these were illegal and confusing calls.  Which they made after they promised not to do that anymore.  Fine.  But far more of us are just asking questions, which you seem to be absolutely uninterested in answering, even as WVWV's most ardent defenders say that we don't have all the facts yet.  If WVWV is indeed guilty of nothing more than rank incompetence, that alone is worth knowing about - particularly if even one black voter is confused by their call into not voting next week.  As far as I can tell, they're doing NOTHING along the lines of what Adam B asked, which is to recontact all the people they confused to set the record straight.  Why can't you use your influence to at least get them to do that, so they can show their good faith?

But I guess you're done with it now.

Where the WVWV Debate Will Go | 21 comments
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