Promising News On 2004-2008 Voting Shifts Via Pollster God Charles Franklin

by: Paul Rosenberg

Sun Nov 16, 2008 at 18:23


We've all seen this county-level map, showing how isolated the shift toward the GOP was since 2004, against the much broader pro-Obama tide:

But this past week, Professor Charles Franklin, of Political Arithmetik and Pollster.com, has added considerably more to the picture of how broad Obama's win was, first by looking at race, then by looking at different demographic groups.  Details on the flip.

Paul Rosenberg :: Promising News On 2004-2008 Voting Shifts Via Pollster God Charles Franklin
Race and Support For Obama

First, Franklin looked at race ("White Vote for Obama in the States"), comparing state-level support for Obama to the percentage of blacks in the electorate.  As many had noted, the shift away from Obama in the upland South corresponded with counties having small black populations.  How did these compare with other parts of the South, they wondered, where increased black support could mask increased white antipathy.  What Franklin found looked pretty dramatic in the way of declining support beyond a certain threashold (click image to enlarge):

However this was due to just a handful of Deep South states, as can be seen in the lower right quadrant.  

As DemFromCT noted at DKos, "White Vote And The South":

I have no intention of doing any South bashing....

But for now, that right lower quadrant is the GOP's regional base; by 2012, TX will be a swing state.

And the GOP? Beyond that right lower quadrant, they've got more work to do than we do, if they ever want to be a national party again.

Responding to feedback in the comments, Franklin did a second post ("White Vote for Obama in the States, Part 2"), which, above all produced this graph, showing how relatively little Obama's performance differed from Kerry's (click image to enlarge):

Yes, Obama underperformed him in the Deep South, but that was already a hard sell for any Dem.  Franklin's comments are worth quoting at length:

For states below 25% African American, the trend line for Obama is above that for Kerry, indicating a general improvement among whites. (Note this is the TREND, individual states may differ-- see below.) But in the deepest of Southern states, which are also the states with the highest African American percentages, Obama falls below the Kerry vote. Now this is based on just four states, GA, AL, MS and LA, but those are also the states in which Obama had his worst performance with white voters.

So in terms of the overall trend, Obama generally improved among whites, but the shift in trend towards the right of the chart is significant....

Three of the four deep south states dropped clearly below their 2004 white support for Kerry. Georgia did not, matching it's 23% white support for the Democrat in both years. Mississippi, the lowest state in 2004, shifted from 14% to 11%, while my home state of Alabama dropped from 19% to 10%, claiming the prize for lowest white support for Obama of any state in the Union. Louisiana went from 24% to 14%, the largest point drop of all.

One other southern state registered a notable drop, Arkansas fell from 36% white support for Kerry to 30% for Obama.

Other states that declined in white support did so by small amounts and for obvious political reasons: Alaska, Arizona and ... Massachusetts.

Two other non-southern states showed small declines: New Mexico (43% down to 42%) and West Virginia (42% down to 41%).  All these last five are inside the confidence interval for no change.

There were a number of states with considerable increases (labeled in the chart for a five point or greater gain.) The most interesting are North Carolina (up from 27% to 35%) and Virginia (up from 32% to 39%.)  Clearly Obama could not have won those states on the white vote alone, but those shifts amount to roughly a 5-6 point boost in statewide vote share, certainly enough to matter.

Also interesting are traditional red states Indiana and Kansas, with gains from 34% to 45% and from 34% to 40% respectively. Also Montana and North Dakota are notable, with gains from 39% to 45% and from 35% to 42%. While the Democrat didn't win three of these four states, these shifts demonstrate that they are no longer as out of reach for Dems as recent past elections might have suggested.

Support For Obama Across Demographic Groups

One reason Obama improved his standing with white voters in some significant red states outside the Deep South is the sheer breadth of his increased appeal across almost all demographic groups, which brings us to Franklin's second focus.

First is a chart showing the relative sizes and shifts of 83 demographic groups. Those above the diagonal shifted toward Obama from Kerry's 2004 performance, those below it shifted away from Obama.  Tellingly, only three groups moved away--"small town," "decided last 3 days," and--perhaps surprisingly "gay". (Click image to enlarge):

For close up of central region in a new window, click here.

A different view of this data arranges all the demographic groups in order of how much they shifted (click image to enlarge):

In today's world, with today's targetted communications and the kind of diverse volunteer base he has, this sort of broad-based gain amongst almost all demographic groups is extremely promising.  Of course he has to govern well, and solve some very difficult problems.  That goes without saying.  But what these graphs show is that the gains earned since 2004 are so broadly distributed that Obama is exceptionally well poised to reap the just rewards for any success through demographically specific communications.

Of course, marketers are now using even more fine-tuned ways of identifying people, so I'm not suggesting that Obama will use these specific groups to map communications strategy.  Rather, I'm saying that this analysis shows extremely broad potential for even more targetted outreach to effectively persuade.

A 53% win is nothing to sneeze at after the past 40 years.  But this analysis should persuade anyone that we have very strong potential to significantly increase that margin in 4 years.  Naturally, solving realworld problems comes first and foremost.  But if we do that this data shows a very strong indication that we can reap the rewards of long-term political dominance.


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The gay vote (0.00 / 0)
So gays were more Republican in this election than the previous one...by double digits?  WTF?

Anyone got any analysis on that they can point to?  Without looking into it at all, my guess would be that perhaps more gay people voted in '04 than in '08, motivated by the national prominence of the anti-gay-marriage amendment that the Republicans were pushing.  Perhaps that motivated some normally non-political gays to go vote in '04, but then they stayed home this time.  Then again, Prop 8 in California may have worked in the opposite direction this time around, by more directly motivating some gay people to vote as compared to '04.


I Think Kerry Had High Visibility With Gays (0.00 / 0)
They both got strong gay support, it was just hard for Obama to match Kerry's level, particularly since McCain isn't nearly as threatening as Bush was.

Still, I found it surprising, even if I can sort of explain it to myself.

"You know what they say -- those of us who fail history... doomed to repeat it in summer school." -- Buffy The Vampire Slayer, Season 6, Episode 3


[ Parent ]
Some comparative numbers (4.00 / 5)
I found this blog post which gathers the exit poll numbers from the last few elections.  Apparently the gay vote (as measured in those polls) has been around mid-20s for the Republicans, and had a slight uptick to 27% for McCain.  

On the Dem side, it was actually Kerry who had an unusually high level of gay support, at 77%, compared to 66 for Clinton in '96 and 70 for Gore in 2000.  Obama got 70%, basically a reversion to the mean for the Dem candidate with the gay vote.

So the real question might not be "why did Obama do so much worse with gay voters" as it is "why did Kerry do so well with them"?*

*Because he's a French/windsurfing/GAY GAY GAY, say the Republicans  


[ Parent ]
I see a number of possibilities (4.00 / 7)
...but a lot of them of them are nebulous and have to do with race or religion.

However the most straightforward explanation would be "Kerry didn't do well with gay voters, Bush did BADLY with them". Remember, 2004 was the year even the Log Cabin Republicans made a big show of not endorsing Bush. Bush was SO noxious for gay voters-- anti-gay fervor was a central plank if not the central plank of his campaign-- that he couldn't help but inspire gay voters to specifically vote for the other side. McCain couldn't even come close to that, not even with Palin + supporting state marriage amendments. Gaybashing just wasn't a visible element of his campaign. Nobody could sanely call him pro gay rights, but he probably made it pretty easy for gay voters to just kind of "forget" about all that once they were in the voting booth, at least compared to Bush.

On the other hand following the LGBT blogosphere leading up to the election it seems there's simply a lot of mistrust among LGBTs toward Obama. (And I am very hesitant to read much into this because I see little reason to believe that the internet is representative of the real world, but...) If the gay blogosphere is any indicator it seems like the gay community prefers politicians they "know", people who've proven they're not going to backstab once they're in power. People like Hillary Clinton fit that "known quality" kind of thing; Clinton in specific has a long history of doing things like marching in gay pride parades. Obama declined to do those kind of flashy things to "prove" his LGBT support-- he didn't show up for any gay pride parades; he allowed a nastily homophobic gospel singer to appear at one of his campaign events once over a year before the election, didn't toss him out despite complaints, and people were STILL complaining about that over a year later. The things Obama might claim to have credibility with LGBTs about were either stuff people didn't care about (a very strong history fighting for the Illinois State Senate's version of ENDA) or ephermal (promises) or both (speeches in part calling for gay tolerance at black churches etc). Meanwhile during the actual campaign Obama was not much more overt about his gay rights stance during the campaign than McCain was, to the point where in the final days of the California the Yes On 8 people were able to actually get away with doing advertising falsely claiming Obama supported Yes On 8 (he specifically endorsed No... but surprisingly few people knew that).

It personally seems to me that especially given the stark differences between Obama and McCain on gay rights that allowing any of this to prevent an Obama vote would be nothing more or less than ignoring sufficient substance due to insufficient flash, but I could easily imagine the mindset of a gay voter who simply never reached the point of believing that Obama was an ally or that McCain was a threat.

These are all just guesses and I think we really need to get some clear research-grounded answers on why gay voters this election undersupported Obama-- but if it turns out to be the case that he underperformed due to the whole lack-of-trust thing, then this is important because it seems to indicate Obama's level of gay support in 2012 will very heavily hinge on whether or not he follows through on all those promises (say ENDA+DADT+DOMA) he made...


[ Parent ]
Lots of racism (4.00 / 2)
I know this might sound surprising but there is a lot of racism among white gays so I'm not surprised they didn't support Obama.

Look at how they acted with Prop 8 and the blame it on the blacks.


[ Parent ]
there was more GOP gay-bashing (4.00 / 3)
in 2004 than there was this year (Prop 8 notwithstanding).

Join the Iowa progressive community at Bleeding Heartland.

[ Parent ]
This Is True (4.00 / 3)
Gay-bashing was central to the GOP's national campaign in 2004, but not this year.

Indeed, even in California, a lot of gay people were--by their own admission after the fact--largely oblivious to the attacks against them.

"You know what they say -- those of us who fail history... doomed to repeat it in summer school." -- Buffy The Vampire Slayer, Season 6, Episode 3


[ Parent ]
Also, (4.00 / 3)
Gay Republicans were much more vocal this time around.  In particular, I had to deal with endless debate with log cabin-types about Sarah Palin signing domestic partnership into law.  

That, combined with the fact that the Republicans weren't actively denegrating LGBTers this time around, and combined with the fact that Obama had his own problems with us early in the primary makes it not all that surprising that Obama ended up underperforming Kerry, since Bush pretty much did nothing in his seven years in office but tell us to all go repeatedly fuck ourselves.


[ Parent ]
Donnie McClurkin (4.00 / 2)
Obama's support for gay bashing Donnie McClurkin in SC left it's mark.  Gays were a very strong group for Hillary throughout the primary.  Given the ambivalence on Prop 8 (and Obama supporters on national TV speaking out aginast mainataining the gay marriage situation in CA) this is damn obvious.  And I say this as a straight white man.

There's a lot of fence mending needed here.


[ Parent ]
I don't think it would take that much fence mending (4.00 / 2)
Pass a trans-inclusive ENDA and the Matthew Shepperd act, and you've already legigimized yourself.  Repeal DOMA and end don't ask, don't tell, and you've already done more for the LGBT than Clinton did in eight years.  Well, you've undone some of the bad crap Clinton did in his eight years.  But you get the point.

But yes.  McClurkin was a clear sign that Obama was not to be trusted.  And he and Biden both always sounded super uncomfortable when talking about these things.


[ Parent ]
I wish pollsters would (0.00 / 0)
quit using states and counties for their reports, and start using population. Those counties in the top map are rural, low-population counties for the most part. The handful of Deep South states don't have a lot of the population except for GA and TX.

That Map Isn't From Pollsters (0.00 / 0)
It's from election returns.  And as long as we keep voting in these pesky political/georgraphic regions, folks are going to count our votes that very same way.

"You know what they say -- those of us who fail history... doomed to repeat it in summer school." -- Buffy The Vampire Slayer, Season 6, Episode 3

[ Parent ]
yeah but (0.00 / 0)
people move their households from election to election, so the surveys and popular votes are important when you're forecasting. The popular vote is important for making mandates too.

[ Parent ]
And most of the population in TX (4.00 / 2)
is concentrated in about 10 to 20 counties.  Texans love to project this image of themeselves as cowboys and ranchers, but your average Texan is urban or suburban.  

[ Parent ]
Gays and Other Religion (4.00 / 3)
Looking at the graph, I find "Other Religion" which I assume to be something other than Christian or Jewish, that is, Hindu, Sikh, Muslim or Buddhist, for instance, right on the line of doing less well than Kerry -- and I suspect we can, for the sake of analysis, put Gays and Muslims in the same catagory -- clearly potential voting blocks where the presence of wedge issues and tactics pretty much made a direct Obama appeal a non-starter. But these are groups he should have won, without question, so I suppose it is now a matter of demonstrating some concern for particular issues, and yes, a strategy of communicating this, so as to pull them into our tent in four years.  

Rather than looking at this in gross, I'd like to see it broken down at least by state and county.  For instance did the "other Religion" play the same way in Dearborn MI as it seems to here?  Does the Gay pattern replicate in known strong Gay Communities.    


Issues of maximised support? (4.00 / 1)
Obama gained more amongst moderates and conservatives than amongst liberals, and more amongst non-union members than amongst union members.

Might this actually point to the Democratic vote share in those groups already being almost maximised, in that such groups are excluded from the Republican coalition? Only those members of such groups who do not consider it an important part of their identity and voting considerations are going to be voting Republican.

It's just that some Sikhs, for example, will favour Republican economic, cultural or political positions. Most won't, but there will also be some for whom demographics is not destiny.

Forgotten Countries - a foreign policy-focused blog


[ Parent ]
A caveat (4.00 / 1)
The margin of error on some of the small groups (e.g. gays) is probably pretty high, and exit polls have their own complications, so it's worth taking the exact numbers with a grain of salt.

Conduct your own interview of Sarah Palin!

Actually, Their Sample Sizes Are HUGE (4.00 / 2)
So the MOEs on demographic subgroups are not that big.

"You know what they say -- those of us who fail history... doomed to repeat it in summer school." -- Buffy The Vampire Slayer, Season 6, Episode 3

[ Parent ]
lesbians/bisexual womyn partly responsible? (0.00 / 0)
I personally know of 2 women, 1 of whom is bisexual, the other lesbian who did not vote for Obama because they were supporters of Hillary.

The hardest of the hard core support for Hillary came from this part of the feminist universe.  What are the gender breakouts on the "Gay" numbers?

In a possibly unrelated matter, I find it surprising that the term Gay is used to include Lesbians and Bisexuals.  I know there are many Lesbians who are cool with the word "gay" to refer to themselves...but there are many who do not. In reverse, there are almost no Gay women who object to being called Lesbian. Bisexual self-identities are complicated but the numbers are quite low for polling purposes. (not to be confused with bisexual orientation or behavior which are much more substantial segments of the population).


It's a lot of hard work self-identifying as bisexual (4.00 / 1)
Which is why the numbers are kept down as much as they are--you have to be pretty committed to the bisexual identity  if you are going to maintain it, because (both gay and straight) people are stupid about it.  And the fact that you kind of have to work at the identification creates a sort of complex nexus of reasons to want to.

But I would honestly, from my experience in the real world, expect waaaaay more gay males voting for McCain than gay females.  I have met numerous gay male republicans in my life.  I have run into apolitical lesbians, but never lesbian republicans (though they do exist, obviously).  

But once again, Obama did very little to court the gay vote, and often openly shoved us aside.  He kind of shoved us aside.  And in the VP debate, Biden had almost a freebee, but his answer to the 'gay rights' question was almost identical to Palin's.  

I'm overjoyed that it didn't cost the election, but I'm actually kind of glad that the LGBT community left a little signature saying that they're unhappy with what happened this cycle, and that they refuse to just go into hiding when they get asked to be ignored for electoral purposes.


[ Parent ]
House and Senate (4.00 / 2)
There were huge gains in both the House (57 seats if Chris is right) and Senate (at least 13 seats) in this period to go along with a comfortable White House win.  Obama's electoral vote totals are similar to Bill Clinton's numbers from 1992 (370 EV) and 1996 (379 EV).  Republican gloating can't disguise that this has been not a closely divided Republican country but a country with a Democratic lean for the past 20 years on the Presidential level.

Democrats gained both House and Senate seats in every region of the country between 2004 and 2008.  Every region.

In four of the six regions of the country (at least using my breakdowns) the gains were extremely substantial.  

In the Northeast, Democrats went from a 56 D, 35 R, 1 Independent split in 2004 to a 75 D, 17 R split in 2008.  We also picked up 3 Senate seats (PA and RI in 2006, NH in 2008).  This included gains of 6 House seats in NY and 5 in PA.

In the Great Lakes region (OH, In, IL, MI, MN, WI) the area's House delegation flipped from 32 Ds and 45Rs to a likely 45 D 32 R split (assumes pickup in OH-15).  We also picked up a Senate seat (OH in 2006).  Democrats picked up at least one House seat in each of these six states.

In the eight Mountain states (ID,MT,WY,NV,UT,CO,AZ, and NM) control flipped from a 20-8 Republican edge to a 17-11 Democratic edge.  We also picked up three Senate seats (MT in 2006, CO and NM in 2008).

While the South remained Republican, the margins were substantially cut.  Overall, the 13 states went from a 52-88 Republican edge in the House to 65-75 in 2008.  Aside from a 20-12 Republican edge in Texas, the rest of the region is basically a tie.  Remember when we used to complain that gerrymandered FL at 18 R to 7 Ds "should be 13-12 or 14-11 at the worst?  Well, it's 15-10 and would be 14-11 if Tim Mahoney's conduct was more responsible.  Individual state delegations flipped in NC and VA and moved from a tie to outright D control in MS. (Assumes we win VA-5 and the 2 LA seats).

That brings us to two regions where Democrats experienced limited gains.  In the disappointing Pacific region, Democrats appear to be picking up a Senate seat in Alaska and also gained an Oregon Senate seat.  Pretty much nothing has happened in the House which went from an overall 45-25 to 46-24 in favor of Democrats.  CA-11 was the only gain (I am not optimistic about CA-4 or CA-44).  National level efforts in Wa-8 (twice), CA-50, CA-4 (twice) and AK-At large as well as pretty strong tries in at least five other districts all failed.  Yes, this is a strong Democratic region but failure to pick up seats in inland CA has been disappointing (to me at least).  As we nudge closer to a new cwnsus, previous R districts are moving closer to toss-up so 2010 like 2000 could be a very good year.

The bastion of Republicanism remains the Farm states in the trans-Missippi midwest.  With only 28 seats (and shrinking this is not much of a base.  Democrats, by picking up two seats in Iowa in 2006 have noved the region from 9 D and 19R to 11 D and 17 R.  The small size means that even modest pickups/holds in 2008 could have resulted in a regional tie (Judy Baker lost by 8,000 votes in MO-9, Nancy Boyda gained a seat in 2006 but lost it back in 2008, Jim Esch came within 12,000 votes IIRC in an Omaha-based district in NE).  We did pick up a Senate seat in MO in 2006.







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