In a Recession, Should States Raise Taxes Or Slash Spending?

by: David Sirota

Tue Dec 16, 2008 at 15:00


I appeared on Your World with Neil Cavuto yesterday to talk taxes. This follows my recent CNBC debate with Grover Norquist on the same issue just a few weeks ago. Cavuto, of course, was much less partisan than Norquist - and yesterday's conversation was pretty substantive.

The question of our discussion was whether states, facing deficits, should raise taxes? Cavuto voiced the standard line that raising taxes could hurt the economy. I countered by pointing out that states - unlike the federal government - are legally unable to go into deficit, and so the choice is not whether to raise taxes in a vacuum, but whether to raise taxes OR cut spending? Because at the state level, you have to do one or the other during deficit-inducing recessions. Faced with that choice, it's clear the better policy is the former, not the latter.

David Sirota :: In a Recession, Should States Raise Taxes Or Slash Spending?
Almost every single economist agrees, the last thing we want to do in a recession is slash government spending. We want, in fact, to increase that spending so that it is a counter-cyclical force to a deteriorating economy. So the question, then, is how to most safely generate the revenue to maintain or increase that spending. By  "most safely" I mean how to raise the revenue in a way that will minimize any negative economic impact. And the answer comes from Joseph Stiglitz:

"[T]ax increases on higher-income families are the least damaging mechanism for closing state fiscal deficits in the short run. Reductions in government spending on goods and services, or reductions in transfer payments to lower-income families, are likely to be more damaging to the economy in the short run than tax increases focused on higher-income families."

So, first and foremost, you don't want dramatic spending cuts (beyond the usual rooting out of waste/fraud) and you don't want to raise taxes on middle- and lower-income citizens who both need the money for necessities, and are the demographics that will most quickly spend money in a stimulative way. That leaves taxes on the super-rich, and Stiglitz - unlike anti-tax ideologues - has actual data to make his case. We know Bill Clinton raised top marginal tax rates in a hobbled economy in 1993, and the economy then boomed. We also know the results of a recent Princeton University study, which looked at states that had raised taxes on the very wealthy during the post-9/11 recession. The analysis found that the tax increases were both the most reliable revenue generator and the safest in terms of minimizing any negative economic impact. Indeed, the states that pursued this course of action saw a net job growth, and almost no tax flight (ie. people fleeing the state because of the tax increase).

This is why I don't subscribe to the notion that Barack Obama must give up or postpone his proposed tax increases on the richest citizens or corporations - because while many have presented grandiose theories, no one has presented any compelling evidence that raising taxes on the very wealthy hurts the economy.

The difference for Obama, of course, is that the federal government can run up deficits, while states cannot. So he has far more leeway. States, on the other hand, have to make the hard choices - and unfortunately, one of the biggest states is making bad ones.

As you'll see in the Fox News clip, Cavuto starts our discussion with the news that New York Gov. David Paterson is proposing a mix of spending cuts and regressive tax and fee increases on the middle class (a sales tax, a tuition tax increase, etc.) to deal with his state's huge budget deficit. That's right, in one of the most unequal states in the country - in a state that domiciles some of the richest financial industry fat cats in the country - the governor is against even a slight increase in income taxes on the highest earners. Somehow, he thinks it will be better to punish his state's working-class with the double-whammy of service cuts and tax increases.

Paterson will be pushed, though, by grassroots groups such as the Working Families Party, which is championing a millionaire's tax - one that a new poll shows 75 percent of the New York public broadly supports. The battle promises to be an epic one, pitting the Empire State's fat cats and unelected governor against the rest of the state. And it is a battle that will likely commence in states all over the country. If progressives lose, the end result will be tax and budget policies that both hammer an already teetering middle class and further weaken the macro economy.  


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Why can't you combine rational economic arguments with moral arguments? (0.00 / 0)
David,

You missed an important opportunity to present a moral argument on this issue.  I realize you are trying to stay on a focused message - States can't go into deficit, must increase govt spending, have to fund this increased spending, can't tax the middle class and poor, therefore tax the rich....

But you convince nobody watching this on tv.  People make a lot of decisions based on the emotional gut reaction they have.  George Lakoff talks a bit about it in his book:

The Political Mind: Why You Can't Understand 21st-Century American Politics with an 18th-Century Brain

But as long as progressive politicians and activists persist in believing that people use an objective system of reasoning to decide on their politics, the Democrats will continue to lose elections. They must wrest control of the terms of the debate from their opponents rather than accepting their frame and trying to argue within it.

Morally/ethically, who benefits the most from a stable society in which the economy hums along, police and fire departments protect people, business contracts are enforced, corruption is kept to a minimum etc??  Not all of us are going to be rich.  Many rich people have worked very hard to get there.  Irregardless, we can choose to live in a society that is governed by the basic ethos in which those that benefit the most from this country's system of laws and infrastructure, must pay the greater share.  

Reframe even as you're making the objective point.  You didn't win the overall argument with Cavuto even though logically and objectively you were correct.

Regards,

Patrick in Pasadena, CA



Bravo! (0.00 / 0)
Patrick, thanks for your comment. It seems to me that all Sirota ever really wants to do is see himself on T.V.  

[ Parent ]
Nice ad hominem (0.00 / 0)
Love the ad hominem. Don't dare talk about substance now. I know - tax stuff is too hard. Ad hominem is more fun!

[ Parent ]
Not helpful. (4.00 / 2)
Munodi,

That comment was not helpful.  If you think you could be a better public spokesperson for liberal populism, write a book and do the work Sirota has done.

In the meantime, let's try and expand the discourse.

Just a suggestion.

Patrick


[ Parent ]
A few items on tax policy (0.00 / 0)
1. Not all sales taxes are created equal.  Not all sales taxes are regressive.  In fact, some are downright progressive.  It's all about what is exempt.  Oftentimes, higher-end services are exempt, like accounting lawyering, and financial management.  Reducing exemptions to raise revenue, and perhaps using this as an offset to a tax expenditure in the form of a middle-class tax cut or affirmative spending, now that's good progressive policy that generates increases in aggregate demand and makes the economy as well as our tax and budget regime more fair for the working- and middle-class.

2. Same deal with fees as with sales taxes.

3. Speaking of aggregate demand, we are in a crisis of that.  This is not a mortgage crisis or a credit crisis or a housing crisis before this is an aggregate demand crisis.  The AD crisis causally precedes these others.

State tax and budget policy can manage this a bit (though not nearly as much as federal fiscal policy).  "Raising taxes" is not a uniform proposition.  Increasing marginal tax rates on the highest end of the income spectrum, levying one-time capital gains taxes or super-wealthy property taxes, and getting rid of bad sales tax exemptions are all ways of increasing taxes on the wealthiest and highest income-earners.  Doing so raises taxes, and subsequent revenue with two positive consequences.  One is that revenue is raised so spending doesn't need to be cut, so as not to poke holes in the floor of aggregate demand.  It might even fund increases in spending that would help raise this floor.

The other is that the budget is balanced on the backs of those who are not likely to pump short-term money back into the consumer spending stream, which lower- and middle-income earners do.  Multiplier effect, have at it.

This follows from orthodox economic theory and the empirical evidence.  

4. George Lakoff is not necessarily a good political scientist.  There are not absolute rules in the way people respond to political messaging.

Now is the time to make clear, resolute statements of facts and summarize them succinctly.  

As it turns out, Democrats did win in 2008, because the effects of Republican policy have been borne out negatively, writ large.

And as it turns out, economics and tax & budget policy is complex.  Much more so than simple bumper-sticker statements.  

Also, morality and ethics are different things are not necessarily 100% overlapping.  And there is no such word as "irregardless."  


Thanks for the English lesson. (0.00 / 0)
Spock,

It's irrelevant to the discussion unless you too feel the need to take someone down a peg to make yourself feel better.

Regarding Lakoff, he is making a perfectly valid point.  People generally don't respond to a purely factual message.  Obama didn't win people over strictly on an issue campaign.  He created a brand and image that people responded to emotionally.  This augmented his message of calm competence on the issues.

I hate to use the word "frame" because it became overused with Lakoff post-2004 election analysis, but framing the liberal progressive position in such a way that a narrative is created which people respond to emotionally is necessary to win elections and win on the issues.  

David will improve his effectiveness as a liberal talking head if he finds a way to frame his messages to appeal at an emotional/moral level.

Regards,

Patrick


[ Parent ]
Raise taxes (0.00 / 0)
What is sad about all this is that the first African-American governor in New York history who is also functionally blind is doing this.  Why can't he be like other disabled governors, such as FDR?  And why are African-American political leaders not more progressive, at least in economic and fiscal matters?

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