Hoyer Postpones FISA Roll-out

by: Matt Stoller

Fri Oct 05, 2007 at 11:10


Good news.

Rep. Steny Hoyer (D-MD), the House Majority Leader, postponed a press conference announcing new reforms of the Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Act after progressive lawmakers banded together and said they would fight any legislation that did not include a set of eight principles on wiretapping that preserve the "rule of law."

"What's most significant is that the Progressive Caucus came together and said to the leadership that all 72 of us require that these provisions be included," said Caroline Fredercikson, Legislative Director for the American Civil Liberties Union. "This changes the dynamic significantly."

Rep. Hoyer had planned to roll out the new FISA reform bill at 1:30 PM today. A spokesperson from his office told the Huffington Post that the House Intelligence Committee had decided to postpone completion of the legislation, though it's not clear that the letter from the Progressive Caucus influenced their decision. Votes in the House were also canceled today. The committee was not available at press time.

The ACLU said it had not been briefed on the nature of the reforms that the Democratic leadership was preparing to get behind.

This is a three part system.  One, the freshmen are saying that they don't want this bill, which hurts the leadership argument that they are doing this to 'protect' the freshmen.  Two, the progressive caucus is unified and aggressive against a bill that does not actually fix the problem.  That's significant, since the caucus tends to be fractious.  Three, the Democratic leadership is watching the ACLU's new-found alliance with the blogger activist community and getting nervous at the unpredictable nature of a potential response.

It's fascinating to be a part of this debate.  The power of ideas and organization is substantial.
Matt Stoller :: Hoyer Postpones FISA Roll-out

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Hoyer Postpones FISA Roll-out | 16 comments
hooray Matt (0.00 / 0)
well done!

Good strategy and well executed.  Now if we could get a good bill out, rather than just stopping a bad one...

I have to say, the leadership should have brought in a freshman into the team because some of them seem to be a bit tone deaf.  Like Murtha on ethics, and Hoyer on FISA.

Truth over balance, progress over ideology

No bill's not so bad (4.00 / 1)
The summer legislation expires in Feb., and doesn't include amnesty for the telco's so passing nothing restores FISA then. No bill's preferable to a mediocre bill.



This is a Test of the Emergency Free Speech System. This is only a Test. In an actual Free Speech Emergency, I'll be locked up.
[ Parent ]
good bill (0.00 / 0)
I would prefer a bill that not only reiterated FISA as the law, but also explicitly gave Congress the power to name a special prosecutor to enforce FISA violations by telecos and administration officials AND gave them no statute of limitations on violations.

Putting teeth into FISA seems necessary when the independence of DOJ attorneys has been compromised/placed at risk.

Truth over balance, progress over ideology

[ Parent ]
A "good bill" should address (4.00 / 1)
not just conventional wiretapping, but also law enforcement and intelligence agency access to the cellphone location data collected by the telcos.

Authorised to enable you to be located if you dialed in in an emergency, the architecture as built tracks your phone whenever it's powered to receive calls, and the cell companies have been retaining this record.

The original E-911 legislation failed to address the privacy concerns. Court rulings to date have been mixed, with some allowing for warrantless access for routine law enfiorcement on the theory that you've waived privacy by "sharing" your location history with the telco.




This is a Test of the Emergency Free Speech System. This is only a Test. In an actual Free Speech Emergency, I'll be locked up.

[ Parent ]
Great news...it's about time the progressive caucus (0.00 / 0)
began to put a leash on the Bluedogs. The Bluedogs elected Hoyer over Murtha, and he is a Bluedog leader if not in name. Let's hope they do the same on Iraq war funding.

We in the netroots need to be prepared to do more than rant and rave if that doesn't happen.

Pick a few Bluedogs who voted for warrantless wiretapping and Iraq funding, and let's at least try to show our power. A primary challenge may be more difficult than an independent challenge. Something to think about.

how many indy's (0.00 / 0)
are there in the House?

0.

indy challenges are futile in our 2-party system because each party has a built-in automatic vote of 30-40% and there isn't enough money in the world for any indy challenger to overcome that - just ask Ross Perot.

[ Parent ]
If you have both candidates from the major parties (0.00 / 0)
voting to fund an intensely unpopular war and strategy, then an independent run can win. Trying to unseat a democratic incumbent is nearly impossible. How many have succeeded in the past out of those attempted? As someone who has run (and lost) in a Democratic primary I know what one faces when running against the local Dem establishment and the national party.

An independent run on that issue and others which appeal to independents (the largest block) which gain disaffected Republicans and Democrats could gain a plurality which is what you need to win.

[ Parent ]
Good News Indeed (4.00 / 1)
I am very pleased with the new alliance between bloggers and the ACLU. Who else can we bring in to the fold?
Slashdot, Libertarians n/t (0.00 / 0)




This is a Test of the Emergency Free Speech System. This is only a Test. In an actual Free Speech Emergency, I'll be locked up.
[ Parent ]
Which freshman? It's not clear to me they had.... (0.00 / 0)
any influence over this. Any links since your source doesn't say anything about the Freshman or the netroots. The refusal of the progressive caucus is much more powerful.
I was thinking the same thing (0.00 / 0)
I remember reading that a number of Freshmen congress people voted for the last amendment. So it would be helpful if Matt could expand with some names of those he says do not support the last amendment now and if they did then but have changed their position.
[ Parent ]
Mutt and Jeff? (0.00 / 0)
A hypothesis:

The temporary legislation runs out around Feb 1; Pelosi was saying after it passed that the law needed further revision in the direction of the good guys; Hoyer comes in months early in a manner that suggests capitulation is once again the plan.

And the Progressive worm finally turns.

So, the Dem House leadership go to the WH and say, Sorry, but we're going to have to throw a bone to the crazies.

I'm not suggesting that the Progs are in on it (if, indeed, there's actually an it to be in on in the first place). But it would be a plausible way to go - like I said, this is only a hypothesis.

The WH, of course, would reply that the leadership passed the previous bill against the majority of the majority, and there's no reason why they can't do so again.

The answer to that? The trouble with wielding the Progs as a threat is that they've been so supine so far.

Plus - I don't think Nancy wants to risk having a surrender bill renewing the previous surrender bill passing the House via a discharge petition.

JTA (0.00 / 0)
The current bill - that needs to be replaced - only passed because Pelosi gave it a rule and saw it on its way.

(There wasn't time before the August recess to pass it via discharge petition.)

Hoyer is fun as a hate figure - but the whole notion that this is a solo run (or a duet with Rahm) is surely fanciful. (Or at least, in serious need of supporting evidence.)

[ Parent ]
Good work Matt (0.00 / 0)
You've done excellent work on this post-initial FISA collapse.

John McCain
I Hate To Sound Like A Broken Record, But... (0.00 / 0)
This would be an excellent issue to poll on right now in the precious battleground states where we are supposedly so especially vulnerable. 

Such a poll should have at least 5 parts:

(0) Basic demographics, including party ID, and ideological orientation.

(1) Poll a couple of "conventional" questions so that it's directly comparable to a few other polls that have been done.

(2) Poll on basic knowledge, to see how well-understood the issues are--i.e. what a lousy job the press has done--and how knowledge/disinformation is related to positions.

(3) Poll on specific issues involved, using a progressive framinig of the choices, so that people can point to the effectiveness of promoting a progressive narrative.

(4) Poll on political impact. Ask, flat-out, if Democrats look more wimpy for "emboldening the terrorists" or for abandoning principles as old as the Constitution?  Ask "What's so damn 'conservative' about destroying the Bill of Rights?"  And give folks the leading GOP Presidential contenders positions and ask if that makes voters more or less likely to vote for them.

"You know what they say -- those of us who fail history... doomed to repeat it in summer school." -- Buffy The Vampire Slayer, Season 6, Episode 3

Called DiFi's office this morning... (4.00 / 1)
Always feels like bashing my head against the wall, doing this, but I did it, and here's how it went:

Called her D.C. office number (202.224.3841), got phone-answerer.

Identified myself as a constituent of the Senator and asked if the Senator had decided to grant retroactive immunity to telecommunications companies who violated the law by spying on Americans without a warrant. Was told by phone answerer that she would pass along my thoughts.

Said, no, I hadn't given a thought, I had asked a question: "had the Senator decided to grant immunity... (etc.)?" Was told that the Senator had not yet announced her stance on that question.

Said that it would appear, then, that the Senator had at least not *ruled out* granting retroactive immunity to those accused of violating federal law. Phone answerer hemmed and hawed. I asked if I, as a constituent, could please be told why my Senator had not ruled out granting retroactive immunity to lawbreakers. Was put on hold.

Was transferred to second-level phone answerer, who said same thing as first phone answerer. Asked if I could please be told why my Senator had not ruled out immunity for federal lawbreakers, and asked if she could either confirm or deny the WaPo story that Senate Intelligence Committe Democrats had reached consensus that the telecoms should receive some form of immunity. Was told that the Senator simply had not decided which way she would vote, yet.

Said that I was simply dying of suspense as to which way my Senator would vote on this, but, as a constituent, I'd really like to know why my Senator is, evidently, even considering retroactive immunity for federal lawbreaking. Was told, by second-level phone answerer, that I had already been told all that I could be told on this matter, and that I could always feel free to write them a letter.

Said that I'd tried writing the Senator letters on past issues, for example, before the Senate vote to authorize the invasion of Iraq, and that I had found the results unsatisfactory. Asked if I could at least speak to a legislative aide of the Senator's who has Intelligence Committee responsibilities, so as to be favored with some insight into my Senator's thought process on this issue, or am I, a constituent, entitled to nothing more than to sit in ignorance on such matters and await my elected representative's enlightened decision. Was put on hold again, and then transferred to the voice mail box of someone named Dan Sapphire (Safire?), who, I hope, is a legislative aide. Left my questions and contact information on the voice mail, and now await a return call.

Patrick Meighan
Culver City, CA

Hoyer Postpones FISA Roll-out | 16 comments
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