McCain Moves To Delay Debate, Suspend Campaign

by: Chris Bowers

Wed Sep 24, 2008 at 15:04


Updates now scrolling from top to bottom

Update 3: Obama camp says the debate is on.

Update 2: This just in from the Obama campaign:

At 8:30 this morning, Senator Obama called Senator McCain to ask him if he would join in issuing a joint statement outlining their shared principles and conditions for the Treasury proposal and urging Congress and the White House to act in a bipartisan manner to pass such a proposal.  At 2:30 this afternoon, Senator McCain returned Senator Obama's call and agreed to join him in issuing such a statement.  The two campaigns are currently working together on the details.

So, McCain moves to upstage Obama after Obama made the first "bi-partisan" move. Several things to learn from this. First, trust McCain, and get a fork in your eye. Second, why on Earth was Obama looking to remove the contrast between himself and McCain on this issue? Third, McCain is crazy out of control. He will do anything crazy if it is perceived as helping him, no matter how ludicrous it actually is (such as, say, picking Palin as VP.) What an incredibly dangerous President this guy would be.

Update: Greg Sargent asks the right questions on what McCain means by "suspending" his campaign:

It's not immediately clear what this means in practice. Will all of McCain's ads come down? Will the campaign stop sending out statements? Will campaign aides all leave headquarters and turn out the lights?

Good questions.

****

MSNBC reports that McCain is asking for the debate on Friday to be delayed, in order to return to Washington and focus on the financial "crisis." He has also suspended campaign events after Thursday.

This should end the lingering speculation that McCain will vote against the Bush bailout package. He is jumping on the "give Wall Street what it wants now" bandwagon.

I think Obama should say yes. Let's keep talking about this financial meltdown instead of holding a debate on foreign policy. Sounds good to me. This has gone gone so well for McCain so far, that if he wants to keep focusing on it, I think that is a good idea. But make sure to take a hardline on a progressive proposal that McCain would never accept. This is exactly the sort of contrast we need.
Chris Bowers :: McCain Moves To Delay Debate, Suspend Campaign

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McCain Moves To Delay Debate, Suspend Campaign | 71 comments
Weird (4.00 / 3)
What's to gain by him for doing this? No matter when he does the debates, it's going to brought up that he's been a deregulator for all but the last 60 hours of his life.  
Weird, but might it work (4.00 / 2)
It's weird because the debate would shift, or would have shifted, the focus to foreign policy, which is what McCain wants.

On the other hand, he knew had do something to make it look he gave a shit  about the economy--something to reverse the polling numbers.

Yes, it's transparently political, but there a fair amount of Americans who eat this bipartisan "let's solve problems" (pass bad bills) shit up.

I'll say this: as with Palin, McCain is willing to take risks--much more willing than Obama is.  

[ Parent ]
Well but here's the thing (4.00 / 2)
as per the update.

Was does "suspend" actually mean? Does that just mean he's off the campaign trail but he still has all his ads up? As soon as that comes out I think take a lot of the umphh out of this stunt.

Obama could just say, "Sure I'll go to Washington for a couple days. Let's just be honest here and admit this is just us returning to the senate. We're not really suspending our campaigns."

[ Parent ]
Taking risks (4.00 / 2)
I think that's largely a function of where they are in the campaign.  As Paul says below, McCain knows he's on his way to losing unless something gets shaken up.  

It would be pretty dumb to take big risks if the basics of the election are clearly in your favor, as is the case with Obama.  If all the polls had been showing McCain with a small but solid lead for most of the summer, instead of Obama, then McCain almost certainly wouldn't have rolled the dice with Palin.

[ Parent ]
That's true (0.00 / 0)

  The team losing in the fourth quarter is the one throwing the Hail Marys.

  Let's just hope Obama doesn't put in a prevent defense.  

"We judge ourselves by our ideals; others by their actions. It is a great convenience." -- Howard Zinn

[ Parent ]
Sure, campaigns that (0.00 / 0)
are behind are more likely to take risks, as a rule, but McCain wasn't far behind when he chose Palin, and he's still not. There've been campaigns that were a lot farther behind and still refused to shake things up.

I think is partly a function of their personalities and their socioeconomic niches--a privileged white guy can more afford to take risks--and partly a function of their political parties--Dems are diseased with caution.

[ Parent ]
It's like the "small town hall meetings" thing (0.00 / 0)
McCain is losing the campaign, therefore the less campaigning that happens the better for McCain...
[ Parent ]
Desperate, and maybe unrecoverable error (4.00 / 5)
The public wants to see the candidates talk about this crisis. Ducking the public at the last minute could be a fatal mistake.

He can't walk and chew gum? How many crises did Bush "handle" from Crawford?

We should take maximum advantage of this. It's a real sign of age and weakness. He really probably can't do the debate. Their numbers are tanking, and, well, it's really the most desperate move I've seen.

Portraying Weakness As Strength (4.00 / 3)
It's the oldest play in their book.  It has to be, considering they have nothing but weaknesses.

"You know what they say -- those of us who fail history... doomed to repeat it in summer school." -- Buffy The Vampire Slayer, Season 6, Episode 3
[ Parent ]
It's a gambit. (4.00 / 1)
In chess, a gambit is a risky move - when you give up a piece to gain a positional advantage.  McCain has played a weak move, and is hoping that Obama's counter will put Obama at a disadvantage.

The key to countering a gambit is to see the trap.  If you do, you can often take the piece and still maintain a strategic advantage.  

Or maybe I'm overestimating and the McCain camp is just stoopid.

War is Peace; Freedom is Slavery; Ignorance is Strength; McCain/Palin 2008

[ Parent ]
Hate To Nitpick, But... (4.00 / 1)
Gambits aren't so much risky moves (at least not after centuries of play) and most commonly apply to openings in which only a pawn is sacrificed, and the variations with their various payoffs are generally quite well known.

This is much, much later in the game, and it's pieces, not pawns, at stake.

Calling it a gambit is acceptable, because language commonly works that way--picking up an apsect of a term, rather than the whole meaning.

But since you called attention to the origins, I think it's useful to note how much more reckless McCain's move is than a true chess gambit.  This is entirely characteristic of him, of course.  It's somewhat along the lines of "not so much a maverick, more a mad cow."

"You know what they say -- those of us who fail history... doomed to repeat it in summer school." -- Buffy The Vampire Slayer, Season 6, Episode 3

[ Parent ]
I concede. (4.00 / 1)
A gambit is usually well thought out.

Sometimes a player can win by playing reckless, hoping that their opponent doesn't have enough of a command of the fundamentals of the game to counter.  

But when you play reckless against a master, you are crushed.

I'm hoping Barack is a master.

War is Peace; Freedom is Slavery; Ignorance is Strength; McCain/Palin 2008

[ Parent ]
Load of crap... (4.00 / 2)
I don't even know what to say... Whatever he says about "suspending" his campaign, this is a deeply political move.
It swallows the news cycle (4.00 / 1)
Right at the time that Fannie Mae disclosed it had been paying Rick Davis $15,000 per month for three years, ending last month.

Maybe it's a position of weakness, but it throws people for a loop.  Was the natural trajectory of his campaign about to go down some very treacherous terrain?

[ Parent ]
He's trying to look presidential and nonpartisan (4.00 / 5)
Substantively, I think it's silly; for the debates are not going to get in the way of any resolution.  It also sounds logistically unlikely, considering all the preparations that go into these things.

But I also suspect that the best thing for Obama might be to agree IMMEDIATELY, thereby taking he wind out of McCain's nonpartisan, presidential-sail.  And besides, the more attention on the substance of the economy, the better.

Maybe Obama could (4.00 / 4)
say: let's debate the bailout.  
[ Parent ]
I like that idea (4.00 / 1)
Say he wants to debate the bailout, and do it in D.C. on Friday.
[ Parent ]
But That Would Be "Political!" (0.00 / 0)
Horrors!

"You know what they say -- those of us who fail history... doomed to repeat it in summer school." -- Buffy The Vampire Slayer, Season 6, Episode 3
[ Parent ]
Obama wants to retain flexibility on bailout too (0.00 / 0)
Some bailout might be necessary.

It seems likely that a quick bailout is not necessary.

But Obama doesn't want to get locked-in at this point. And a debate would require him to make definitive statements.

[ Parent ]
I've changed my mind (0.00 / 0)
30 seconds later, I think that this move will be seen for what it really is: nothing more than a a gimmick.  And if the public sees that too, then Obama might as well decline.
[ Parent ]
Here's what I don't understand (4.00 / 1)
Why would Obama reach out to McCain privately?

How does that benefit you politically?

The idea would be to force McCain to come around to your way of thinking or to refuse to and pay the price. This should be played out publicly, no?

[ Parent ]
Oh good lord (4.00 / 1)
Maybe he's actually interested in trying to reach an agreement that will be good.  If the two of them could actually agree on something and issue a joint statement, there's a very strong chance that a bill along those lines would pass.  The two leaders of the two parties agreeing and all that.

Now, that might be good or bad depending on the agreement.  But is it so crazy to think that there might be some value in trying to get that done, based on the idea that it's important for the government to...function.  

And maybe he's not solely concerned with how that will play politically.  Maybe, just maybe.

Would that really be so bad?

[ Parent ]
That is (4.00 / 1)
probably what McCain fears most right now because in a debate the unresolved terms of the bail-out would expose him even more. He wants a packaged deal, up or down, you know the schtick.
[ Parent ]
prepping for debate takes time (4.00 / 1)
OTOH, most of the prepping happens more than three days in advance.
[ Parent ]
OMFG! Choose your subtext! (4.00 / 2)
(A) No, as a matter of fact, I can't walk and chew gum at the same time.

(B) Foreign policy strength?  What foreign policy strength?

(C) Pay no attention to the man behind the curtain!  

"You know what they say -- those of us who fail history... doomed to repeat it in summer school." -- Buffy The Vampire Slayer, Season 6, Episode 3

Because the Foreign Policy Debate Would've Been The End Game (4.00 / 2)
If/when Obama stands on the stage and shows an understanding of foreign policy on par with McCain's, the election is over. He removes the last two question marks the voters have about him: foreign policy and readiness to lead. Obama just has to show credibility on foreign policy to close the sale. McCain's people know it.
[ Parent ]
Even More Fundamentally (4.00 / 2)
McCain is right back where he was after Obama's aceptance speech.

The Palin bounce is not only gone, it's starting to bounce back the other way.  Which leaves McCain in the same old hole: he's already lost the election unless he does something dramatic to shake things up.  Well, this is just that sort of thing.

"You know what they say -- those of us who fail history... doomed to repeat it in summer school." -- Buffy The Vampire Slayer, Season 6, Episode 3

[ Parent ]
Foreign Policy (4.00 / 5)
I wouldn't accept at face value that this move is about the bailout crisis. Perhaps the McCain camp hopes to move the foreign policy debate until closer to the election. Yeah, they agreed to put it first but may now believe that was a bad move.  
possible Obama response (4.00 / 1)
My quick reaction is that Obama should say something like:

I am open to being flexible. But unless Sen. McCain has been doing a bunch of stuff I don't know about, he's been avoiding taking a position on President Bush's proposed bailout of irresponsible investors. It seems like he's waiting to see how things develop, rather than showing any kind of leadership.

So, I'm willing to be flexible about the debate. But I hope John McCain isn't shirking his responsibility to lead on the economy and then using his failure to do anything on the economy as an excuse to avoid a debate on foreign policy.


Weird (4.00 / 1)
But I guess McCain's calculation is pretty clear:

(1) If Obama declines, McCain gets to accuse him of "playing politics in a time of crisis" or whatever.

(2) If Obama accepts, McCain figures to get credit for doing something (take your pick) presidential, mavericky, non-political, etc.

So as far as the McCain camp is concerned, they get at least something positive out of it either way.  

Well, also (0.00 / 0)
Let's say a deal is struck: McCain will claim credit.

Or let's say the deliberations go on, forcing Congress to stay in session--they were supposed to break, rigth?--and McCain takes credit for whipping them into shape. He loves playing the Congressional hall monitor and the public loves him in that role.

Still, I'm pretty sure as long as the focus is on the economy, Obama wins.

[ Parent ]
It's a gambit to make McCain look like a leader, with Shock Doctrine thrown in. (4.00 / 2)
McCain says jump, Obama has to follow.  Who's the leader?  Who's from the Daddy Party?  It could backfire, and I hope it does.

It's also Shock Doctrine - McCain's trying to ratchet up the fear of doing nothing.  

War is Peace; Freedom is Slavery; Ignorance is Strength; McCain/Palin 2008

That it is (4.00 / 1)
But in this case, I don't think it will work.
[ Parent ]
how does McCain fare under pressure, America sees (4.00 / 1)
it is part of a pattern- when the going gets tough McCain runs away.
Press conferences are too hard for Palin, run away.
McCain is sinking in the polls, delay the debate.
Troopergate threatens Palin, the McCain campaign makes everyone skip out on the subpoena.
Reporters aren't buying the campaign kool aid, quit holding press conferences and stop press access.
Over and over when times get tough McCain runs away.
Friend just pointed out something else... (0.00 / 0)
Is this an effort to get the FP debate to go right before the election?

In other words, if it's postponed, when does it get postponed to?  Probably after the other debates, which would put it within 2 weeks of the election.  I definitely think this could be the campaign's hope...

No postponement... (0.00 / 0)
...cancellation.

Obama should not agree to reschedule... if McCain wants to cancel it, it's canceled for good...

REID: Voting against us was never part of our arrangement!
SPECTER: I am altering the deal! Pray I don't alter it any further!
REID: This deal keeps getting worse all the time!

[ Parent ]
The economic crisis does relate to foreign policy (4.00 / 2)
The economic crisis and bailout is germane in a Foreign Policy debate. McCain's "strong suit" debate would be crushed on Friday.

And the American people need to hear where both candidates stand on the bailout. What better forum than a debate?

if there is a crisis like team Bush is claiming (0.00 / 0)
It really is a foreign policy issue b/c it affects global markets and we have to decide how to deal with foreign creditors who willed feel scammed if they were sold fraudulent debt and aren't part of the bailout.
[ Parent ]
Think Obama should stand strong on this... (4.00 / 1)
And as you mention, maybe just change the terms... Say that they should debate the crisis on Friday, that the American people want answers and they want to hear the debate on this.

The election is not going to be postponed because of the crisis and the world still moves on even when in crisis... McCain needs to grow a pair and be able to keep a grasp on things even when in crisis.

No, Walking Is Important (0.00 / 0)
You can chew gum anytime.

Or, better yet, Sarah Palin can chew gum!

"You know what they say -- those of us who fail history... doomed to repeat it in summer school." -- Buffy The Vampire Slayer, Season 6, Episode 3

[ Parent ]
Team Obama should agree to move this debate... (4.00 / 1)
...to the time they were going to have the "Town Hall Debate."

And kill the Town Hall Debate.

Obama should call his bluff... (0.00 / 0)
...cancel the foreign policy debate entirely... no foreign policy debate, period.

That would shut McCain up good!

REID: Voting against us was never part of our arrangement!
SPECTER: I am altering the deal! Pray I don't alter it any further!
REID: This deal keeps getting worse all the time!

Wouldn't work (0.00 / 0)
It would make Obama look like he's scared to debate McCain on those issues (foreign policy).
[ Parent ]
Disagree with this (0.00 / 0)

 I want a foreign-policy debate. The sooner the better.

 Look at the polls. The voting public has been turning steadily, if not yet decisively, towards Obama. McCain's playing defense in places like Indiana and North Carolina (not to mention Virginia). There's probably one nagging thing keeping voters from fully committing to Obama, and that's his perceived foreign-policy shortcomings.

  Expectations for Obama on this issue aren't all that high. So all he has to do is look competent and rational in a foreign-policy debate, and he pretty much closes the sale with the public. You and I know he's very capable of doing that, but the low-info voters don't. Yet.

   And that's probably the real reason McCain's trying to wuss out of the debate. The timing and the polling is all wrong for him right now.

 

"We judge ourselves by our ideals; others by their actions. It is a great convenience." -- Howard Zinn

[ Parent ]
Asymmetric Warfare (4.00 / 5)
This, the Palin pick, attack ads with obvious lies -- they all point to an asymmetric strategy that the McCain campaign is employing because it knows that the Obama campaign has an inherent advantage. Watch for more wildly unconventional tactics as the election date draws nearer and Obama continues to hold the upper hand in the polls.  
a successful assymetric campaign (0.00 / 0)
would keep a candidate close and then deliver a knockout blow at the last minute, right?
[ Parent ]
Tactics drive strategy (0.00 / 0)
Yes, close and off balance is part of the tactics. But an important principal of asymmetric warfare is that the disruptive tactics drive the strategy. One movement does not have to anticipate another. Decisions can be made ad hoc.
[ Parent ]
Keep a close eye on this people! (4.00 / 1)
Greenwald reported earlier today that for the first time in 100 years the US Army is posting a brigade within the US permanently (and it used to be illegal under the Posse Comitatus Act. Apparently that was suspended a couple of years ago.)

The GOP is losing badly according to the latest polls. They're up to something. Remember, Cheney had a plan years ago to put up to 7 million of us in camps while the "state of emergency" lasted. This ain't good.

am i missing something here? (4.00 / 1)
who, among the american people, wants the debate to be postponed?  how is this advantageous for mccain?

why doesn't obama just say, 'no, the american people want a debate. mccain and i agreed to a debate.  you can't back out of an agreement at the last minute.'

am i missing something?

what you're missing is that McCain's internal (0.00 / 0)
polling is bad
[ Parent ]
He's trying to look "presidential".... (0.00 / 0)
and trying to change the subject and give him some positive press....

REID: Voting against us was never part of our arrangement!
SPECTER: I am altering the deal! Pray I don't alter it any further!
REID: This deal keeps getting worse all the time!
[ Parent ]
Obama ratfucked... (4.00 / 1)
Obama makes a move behind the scenes,

...himself. They should have announced their move when they made it. If they didn't see this rat fuck coming...

"Don't take much, does it, elected Democrats, to get your balls tucked up." Cf.

Exactly (4.00 / 1)

 Obama TRUSTED McCain????

 That's beneath idiotic.  

"We judge ourselves by our ideals; others by their actions. It is a great convenience." -- Howard Zinn

[ Parent ]
Worse! (0.00 / 0)
It's not that he trusted McCain.

He didn't even realize there was anything he was trusting McCain about.

Obama never did get the whole "Party of Nixon" thing.  "The excesses of the 1960s" don'tcha know!

"You know what they say -- those of us who fail history... doomed to repeat it in summer school." -- Buffy The Vampire Slayer, Season 6, Episode 3

[ Parent ]
NOW he wants to go to Congress? (0.00 / 0)
McCain has a worse attendance record than the guy who was in a coma. And NOW he wants to race back to Congress to work? Where has be been for the last two years?
Ratfucking From The Party Of Nixon! (0.00 / 0)
I'm, like, all Claude Raines, ya know?

"You know what they say -- those of us who fail history... doomed to repeat it in summer school." -- Buffy The Vampire Slayer, Season 6, Episode 3
Is "ratfucking" the right term here? (0.00 / 0)
Correct me if I'm wrong, but I thought that referred to something else: a clandestine and/or deniable move of sabotage, e.g. the Canuck Letter.  That's not quite what we're talking about in this case, is it?
[ Parent ]
General vs. Specific (0.00 / 0)
This is the flip side of what I just wrote about "gambits" above.

Nixon built his entire career on the general form of ratfucking, acting honorably in public and dishonorably in private, going in a directly contrary direction.  So, this falls squarely into the more general meaning of the term.

The more specific meaning is focused on the covert private act itself, as with the Canuck Letter, or the whispering campaign Nixon used to tar Jerry Voorhis as a supposed "Communist."

"You know what they say -- those of us who fail history... doomed to repeat it in summer school." -- Buffy The Vampire Slayer, Season 6, Episode 3

[ Parent ]
keep debate, postpone campaign (0.00 / 0)
Obama should suspend his campaign for a few days, but also insist that the debate be held. That way, he can match McCain for "keeping country first", but also show some independence by insisting on debate.  
Fine (0.00 / 0)
If the Palin/McCain campaign doesn't want to debate, don't show up.  But, please explain why you could find the time to campaign for the last 18 months while the problem simmered and stewed.  If the problem is that Senators like McCain have been more focussed on their NEXT job, rather than their CURRENT job, then maybe he should just admit he can't manage more than one task at a time.


"It sounds wrong...
     ...but its right."
what does McCain mean by suspending campaign? (4.00 / 1)
No TV ads?

This should be ridiculed by the Obama campaign.

There's going to be an election in November. Under the U.S. Constitution elections happen at very specific times. If Sen. John McCain thinks... frankly I can't fathom what he's thinking. The only thing that makes sens is the guy doesn't think he has the financial resources to campaign and he thinks this will somehow create pressure on the Obama campaign to stop running advertising.

There's an election in November. The Obama campaign is committed to using the time between now and the election to make the case to as many Americans as possible that electing Sen. Barack Obama is the best option for the country.

If Sen. John McCain thinks not campaigning is the best way to win elections, that would be like trying to win a football game without practicing.

If Sen. John McCain is trying to bamboozle people he's going to take the high road, please remember what kind of campaign advertisements he's been running to date. Is it plausible that the guy who has run perhaps the sleaziest, most dishonest ads in the history of U.S. presidential politics is too honorable to campaign during what President Bush claims is an economic crisis? Please....

If Sen. John McCain thinks of himself as too honorable to do the unsavory aspects of campaigning for President of the United States, he probably should have realized this... sometime before he ran for POTUS. This is his second campaign.


Exactly! (4.00 / 1)
So that means McCain will be pulling his negative ads of the air in PA right? Because it's a nonpartisan time for solutions? Right?

This move is fraudulent, and it won't be hard for Obama's campaign to poke holes in.

[ Parent ]
Another idea... (0.00 / 0)
How about rather than just suggest they "debate" the bailout Friday, Obama should suggest that they "discuss it" in an open format, etc... something to that effect.  This sort of takes the partisan ring out of it a bit...
real reason McCain is postponing: (4.00 / 1)
Matlock!
Abe Simpson Says (0.00 / 0)
"We love Matlock because he puts the young people in jail!"
[ Parent ]
Update 4: Obama camp says the debate is on. (4.00 / 1)
Damned right. It better be. Obama would be a fool to let this opportunity to close the sale pass by.
Maybe a partial gambit to neutralize some of Obama's (0.00 / 0)
attacks against him during the debate (knowing that Obama would never agree to postpone the debate). Then McCain can argue that he's being respectful and non-partisan and this is not time for partisan mud-slinging blah blah blah. So he tries to force Obama off his game so he won't attack McCain for his naked hypocrisy in becoming a populist in the last 5 days and for the whole Rick Davis thing and the fundamentals of the economy, etc., etc.
[ Parent ]
Obama camp already asked McCain to debate financial crisis Friday... (0.00 / 0)
From FirstRead:

"At 2:35 p.m., McCain called back and mentioned whether they should meet at the White House and delay the debate. Asked whether they should delay the debate, Gibbs said that this is a global financial crisis -- and there would be no better way to shed light this crisis than to debate it.  Gibbs says they have not decided whether or not it would be better to postpone the debate -- but want to talk to the sponsors (the debate commission) first.

NBC's Kelly O'Donnell reports, advisors say they are also reaching out to Obama Campaign Manager David Plouffe to discuss pulling ads as well. (That can be difficult once they are in station traffic rotations.)"

Suggested Obama response... (0.00 / 0)
The McCain campaign has been the most secretive, least transparent campaign in modern American history.  

At every turn, they've refused to answer questions, and have spent more time talking about lipstick and complaining about press coverage than talking to the American people about how to confront the many challenges our country faces.

And now John McCain wants to shut off communications with the American people, and cancel a public debate that will let the voters see both candidates discuss our nation's security?

The Republican Party seems to think that governing is incompatible with openly communicating with the American people.  We've seen Iraq, Hurricane Katrina, and the Wall Street crisis -- the American people know that approach is a failure.

It's time for more communication with the American people, not less.  Going to communities in Indiana or Nevada or New York or North Carolina, meeting people, talking with them about the issues that matter to them, and answering their questions isn't a distraction from governing -- it's a vital part of it.

Shutting the American people out of politics is just more of the same Bush/Cheney approach to politics, and I want no part of it.  Sen. Biden and I will continue to visit Americans in their communities, to talk about how to change our country, and to answer questions from voters and the media, just as we've done throughout this campaign.

Obama camp shouldn't have said, "The debate is on" (4.00 / 1)
Clearly, they should have said, "It's on LIKE DONKEY KONG!"  
The debate is on (0.00 / 0)

  Nice recovery by Obama. Didn't take the bait.

  And he's showing he can multitask. Unlike his opponent.  

"We judge ourselves by our ideals; others by their actions. It is a great convenience." -- Howard Zinn

McCain Moves To Delay Debate, Suspend Campaign | 71 comments
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