Lieberman Might Be Losing His Base

by: Chris Bowers

Mon Nov 17, 2008 at 19:30


Two years ago, Senator Tom Carper of Delaware was one of six sitting Democratic Senators to support Joe Lieberman even after he lost the Democratic primary to Ned Lamont. As such, I predicted Carper would be one of Lieberman's eight strongest supporters in the fight over his chairmanship. However, he had surprisingly harsh words for Lieberman today:

Carper did not rule out stripping Lieberman of his coveted gavel running the Homeland Security and Governmental Affairs Committee, or imposing other sanctions like taking away seniority on other committees or a subcommittee on Armed Services.

Carper said he and three other Senate Democrats have been making phone calls to "take the temperature of our caucus." He said the purpose of the calls was not to lobby senators for any particular action for or against Lieberman, but "just to see where people's hearts and their minds are."

Carper said that "many of my colleagues ... are very angry with his criticism of Sen. Obama," but he would not say which sanctions he prefers.

If tom Carper is wavering, then Lieberman could be in serious trouble tomorrow. For Tom Carper to be undecided on this vote is, in electoral terms, the equivalent of Georgia being a toss-up in the presidential campaign. If Lieberman is struggling to win a member of what should be his base voters, then we should be on a path to win this thing.

Then again, commenters have noted that every Senate office they call is claiming to be undecided on the Lieberman vote. So, rather than Carper's public indecision being a sign of Lieberman in trouble, perhaps this is simply a vote where almost no one in the Senate wants to tell the public where they stand. Either way, give one last call to your Democratic Senators, and help push them over the edge. Even though it's late, it's OK to leave a message. They will still hear it before the vote tomorrow.
Chris Bowers :: Lieberman Might Be Losing His Base

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Lieberman Might Be Losing His Base | 16 comments
So should we contact Kay Hagan? (0.00 / 0)
I'm confused whether members of the caucus in the next Congress have a vote tomorrow.
I think they do - (0.00 / 0)
If I understand right, Newly elected members would have a vote - Warner, Hagen, Shaheen, Udall, Udall, and Merkley

Members who have not been declared as winners don't get a vote - i.e. Martin, Franken, Begich

And departing members, i.e.: Obama and Biden do not.  

[ Parent ]
Warner .. Hagen .. (0.00 / 0)
and Shaheen will probably vote for Liebertoad .. I don't know about the Udalls .. and I believe Merkley is a vote against Liebertoad
[ Parent ]
You see this, Chris? (4.00 / 2)

 It's not looking good, according to this CNN report.

 I'll still call, but it looks like the Democrats remain deathly afraid of what Lieberman might do. Maybe, you know... campaign for the Republicans?  

"We judge ourselves by our ideals; others by their actions. It is a great convenience." -- Howard Zinn

I was just going to point every one .. (4.00 / 1)
to Glennzilla .. where he references the same CNN article .. it's nice to know that the Senate Democrats like spitting in our faces time and again .. they won't learn till they get voted out of office ... that's the only way to teach those SOB's
[ Parent ]
It's just amazing... (0.00 / 0)

  The Senate Democrats just can't resist indulging their impulses to get impaled on spears. I wonder how many fixed fights Harry Reid was part of when he was a boxer...

  Joe Lieberman just told them that they're all a bunch of unpatriotic subversives. And they REWARD him???

  I guess that in the wake of the trouncing the Republicans got two weeks ago, the Democrats found themselves lost and confused... The Republicans lost! Whom do we capitulate to now??? Whom can we be doormats for???

  And voila... Joe Lieberman. Every craven coward needs a paper tiger to fear.

 

"We judge ourselves by our ideals; others by their actions. It is a great convenience." -- Howard Zinn

[ Parent ]
It's just amazing... (0.00 / 0)

  The Senate Democrats just can't resist indulging their impulses to get impaled on spears. I wonder how many fixed fights Harry Reid was part of when he was a boxer...

  Joe Lieberman just told them that they're all a bunch of unpatriotic subversives. And they REWARD him???

  I guess that in the wake of the trouncing the Republicans got two weeks ago, the Democrats found themselves lost and confused... The Republicans lost! Whom do we capitulate to now??? Whom can we be doormats for???

  And voila... Joe Lieberman. Every craven coward needs a paper tiger to fear.

 

"We judge ourselves by our ideals; others by their actions. It is a great convenience." -- Howard Zinn

[ Parent ]
I wouldn't put it past (4.00 / 2)
Joementum's people to drop that bit of data into the ear of one of their media leak contacts to set the tone the day before the meeting, but given the way the dem caucus kissed his feet after the primary booted him off the dem line, I would consider it more likely that this is the "compromise" that was worked out.

And as to that - Compromise?  WTF?  When does the guy with a boot on his neck get to "compromise"?  Truly pathetic.

[ Parent ]
When does the guy with a boot on his neck get to "compromise"? (4.00 / 1)
I believe that's when your dealing with our Democratic Senatorial Caucus, aka the "Club".
[ Parent ]
My again optimistic reading (0.00 / 0)
I'm gonna read the tea leaves again on this...

My reaction to this CNN report is similar to that of Bayh last week saying Lieberman should sincerely apologize. It's almost certainly a balloon from the Lieberman camp, ceding yet more ground knowing that a big "I'm sorry" ain't gonna cut it. He thinks the whip count is going against him right now, so he's offering up another compromise to save his gavel.

Again, Lieberman giving up ground is probably good for our side. It shows that there is a big chunk of the caucus that wants to punish him. Even though it's a slap on the wrist, it's still more severe than what his side was talking about last week.

Conduct your own interview of Sarah Palin!

[ Parent ]
I called my two WA senators (0.00 / 0)
Indicating that I hope that they'd vote to strip him of his DHS chairmanship. Cantwell's office noncommittal on how she'd vote. I forgot to ask the Murray staffer.

I'm guessing that they'll vote to let him keep it. It's a very military and defense industry heavy state with lots of pork projects, and I doubt that they'd want to ruffle his feathers.

I hope that I'm wrong.

"Those who stand for nothing fall for anything...Mankind are forever destined to be the dupes of bold & cunning imposture" -- Alexander Hamilton

It's a secret ballot. (0.00 / 0)
They're not going to ruffle his feathers, because he's not going to know how they voted unless they tell him.
[ Parent ]
Knowing him and his pathetic ego (0.00 / 0)
he'll probably hound them to find out how they voted. He's like the Jim Carey character in The Cable Guy.

"Those who stand for nothing fall for anything...Mankind are forever destined to be the dupes of bold & cunning imposture" -- Alexander Hamilton
[ Parent ]
On a related note (4.00 / 1)
More potentially bad news:

Obama advisers: No charges likely vs interrogators

Obama advisers say no charges likely against workers who authorized harsh interrogation methods

LARA JAKES JORDAN
AP News

Nov 17, 2008 17:47 EST

Barack Obama's incoming administration is unlikely to bring criminal charges against government officials who authorized or engaged in harsh interrogations of suspected terrorists during the George W. Bush presidency. Obama, who has criticized the use of torture, is being urged by some constitutional scholars and human rights groups to investigate possible war crimes by the Bush administration.

Two Obama advisers said there's little - if any - chance that the incoming president's Justice Department will go after anyone involved in authorizing or carrying out interrogations that provoked worldwide outrage.

The advisers spoke on condition of anonymity because the plans are still tentative. A spokesman for Obama's transition team did not respond to requests for comment Monday.

Disappointed, if true, but unfortunately not terribly surprised. Um, FISA, anyone?

He's a cautious establishmentarian centrist with some progressive leanings. Period.

And can we please stop using the Orwellian euphemism "harsh interrogation"? It's torture. The Geneva Convention says so, and we're signatories, making is US law. Period.

"Those who stand for nothing fall for anything...Mankind are forever destined to be the dupes of bold & cunning imposture" -- Alexander Hamilton

A lot of pessimists here (0.00 / 0)
I would have thought that the reactions of Carper and Bayh would be hopeful signs.

I guess we'll only know for sure when the historians do their interviews of this time.

The main reason why Carper is in favor of removing Lieberman from the Senate HSGA committee. (0.00 / 0)
Carper will be next in line to become Chairman of Senate HSGA.

Levin(MI)- Top Democrat on the Senate Armed Services Committee. Akaka- Top Democrat on Senate Veteran Affairs Committee.

Lieberman Might Be Losing His Base | 16 comments
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