How Are We Doing?

by: Matt Stoller

Sun Jul 29, 2007 at 15:41


We started OpenLeft on July 9, with the goal of focusing on building a progressive governing majority.  Politics is not about parties so much as it is about coalitions, identity, and elites, and that's what we've tried to write about.  I've written about how Eliot Spitzer is paying the price for refusing to work with allies, Chris has discussed identity in MA-05 and the Democratic primary, and Mike Lux has discussed the failure of Democratic elites in the 1970s. 

There is a new America waiting on the other side of the transition away from an oil-dominated state, but the transition is going to be ugly.  We won't get a universal internet, a sustainable energy system, a democratic media, impeachment, or an end to the national security state without strong coalitions. 

We're not just writing about coalitions, we're trying to help build them.  That's what Legislation 2.0 with Senator Dick Durbin was about.  Writing legislation online, and working with the Communications Workers of America, the Open Internet coalition, One Economy, Hands off the Internet, DaveyD, Free Press, Moveon, and many others is a model for building a coalition behind universal broadband.  The significance of this experiment isn't clear, but it's gotten a lot of notice.  Grant Gross at IDG News Service (the AP of the tech world) wrote about it, and it was picked up in PC World and InfoWorld.  The St. Louis Post-Dispatch, a paper that covers Durbin, also wrote about it, as did National Journal's Aliya Sternstein (subscription only).  This effort got into political insider press, local press, and tech press.

Now, there were problems.  The most common complaint was that the project was hard to follow and/or intimidating.  Do you agree?  Do you have suggestions for improvement?  Chris and I have been discussing doing something similar for residual troops in Iraq, so we're open to suggestions.

On a larger note, how is the site?  I still feel like I'm finding my voice, like the transition from electoral focus to governing focus is rocky and difficult.  The progressive blogosphere is no longer in a growth period, institutionalizing into YearlyKos, Dailykos, the Huffington Post, Firedoglake, Americablog and of course, Talkingpointsmemo.  The torch of innovation has passed to youtube stars like EmergencyCheese and Obama Girl.  This is a more nonpartisan and less ideological group, comfortable with empowered citizens.  And on the governance side, anti-Bush energy has turned into coalitions around energy, Iraq, media, economic justice and political legitimacy, as well as simple pieces like bringing Web 2.0 to government.  I'm honestly a bit confused about what's going on in politics. 

Anyway, we've been trying to figure out how to make the transition from sheer partisanship to a larger and more movement-oriented perspective.  So how are we doing? 

Matt Stoller :: How Are We Doing?

Tags: , , , , (All Tags)
Print Friendly View Send As Email
How Are We Doing? | 29 comments
Quite well for my part (4.00 / 2)
I showed this site to two heads of local Democratic clubs at the last meeting of my Democratic club (we CA-45th Dems are coalescing as well), as a followup to a netroots talk I gave them earlier.  My favorite feature is the commitment to an equal opportunity to respond, we all like that. 

If the Durbin project was hard to follow, so what? is my feeling.  Wading into policy analysis and weighing various perspectives is hard to follow.  Nature of the beast.

An unappreciated factor may be the project's value as a transcript of the process.  Some of the best professional training consists of just listening as experts hash things out.  It gives more of us a position as the fly on the wall in the meeting room, which promotes transparency in governance, so you had me at hello. 

Biggest advantage (4.00 / 5)
You have not, for the most part, stepped in to the food fight that has become the 2008 nomination.  This is an adult site (not of the xxx variety).  Thank God.
Thank God for that (4.00 / 1)
MyDD used to be by far the most interesting read and my favorite blog.  It has fallen way down on my list just the past two months with the constant primary flame wars.  Please please please don't let that happen here!  I've found a new favorite site and I quite like it without the drama MyDD now has.

John McCain <3 lobbyists
[ Parent ]
Yes (0.00 / 0)
MyDD was my main until we had a bunch of Clinton flamers start and they started flaming non-stop, creating a neverending flame war. 

Now I prefer openleft because it hits the important things, there is a general consensus, and there aren't too many people so diaries stay up long enough. 

[ Parent ]
My only criticism (4.00 / 1)
Is that you keep starting things too early for me on the West Coast to get involved.  7pm eastern is 4pm west coast and I'm not home.  I know it'd be pretty tough to get all these people together at 8:30 or 9 eastern, so I don't really blame anyone.  But if the occasional weekend edition could be put together that'd be awesome.  Don't know if it's possible but yeah.

Otherwise, as David mentioned, the crappy primary stuff hasn't gotten here in force yet.  I really hope that this can be much more about movement building and less about presidential primary blah.

John McCain opposes the GI Bill.

multi takes (4.00 / 3)
I spend a lot of time in emails with people looking for more than Dkos, and I have sent a few here. The more tech oriented they are, the more they seem to like this site.
  For my own tastes I could use to see a little more of the partisanship just so there is some way to feel a part of. The site has a elitist feel to most people I have sent here also, for some of them it's a fit and what they have looked for. Those that don't feel comfortable here, I don't think it's the site, but their need for the kind of excitement that happens when a story breaks that makes the Right look foolish.
  You will find your niche but if you want more participation I would add a dash more partisanship and some way to make people feel like they are noticed. Comments in the threads from the FP'ers that answer some of the comments or questions might help.

Pledge To Ask "The Question"
So far, so good (4.00 / 1)
Well, to write up legislation, policy, intelligently comment on it, just ain't a real emotional "me too" hot bed.  But, I think there are many citizen activists out here who have that level of skill and comprehension.

The idea of "open source" legislation and policy formulation is the ultimate democratization and feedback path with our government. 

There are plenty of sites with "outrage du jour" coverage.

NoSlaves.com  


The Economic Populist

[ Parent ]
Great start + idea (0.00 / 0)
This site is amazingly comfortable to read. I like the tone and mix of topics.

Idea on residual troops: When you do the debate about residual troop you could ask for submissions from Google Maps with no more than a 200 word explanation of the plan with virtual map pins showing where troops would be deployed and why. You could cull the submissions down a reasonable number - maybe jointly ask for submissions with a blog like Intel Dump - and then have commentary on the submissions from policy makers.

John McCain

Stepping Back From The Confusion (4.00 / 1)
I'm honestly a bit confused about what's going on in politics.

You need to readjust your focus.  Change your level of magnifaction. Or just step back. Whatever metaphor works for you, so long as you disengage from the pieces, which, indeed, proliferating and mutating like crazy.

Proliferation and Mutation

Because that's what's going on in politics: the pieces are proliferating and mutating like crazy.  It's a period of flux in which the ways that those pieces shake out, and ultimately stabilize (or not) in their inter-relationships cannot be foreseen.  It's a period of true exploration, and the biggest challenge is keeping ourselves open and finding the compelling new patterns (conceptual, organizational, expressive, etc.)--hopefully ones that are inclusive and synergetic with other patterns, rather than simply trying to dominate and drive all other patterns out.

For instance, one of the things that I'm struggling with is centuries-old "next big thing" meme from most of the Obamaphiles on the site (Jenifer being the outstanding exception.)  The hardest thing for me to communicate is that I want him to be more authentically new, and less superficially so--and just what that means to me, and why.

Realignment

I really think we're at a point of potential political realignment of the sort this country hasn't seen since 1932.  I think we desperately need such a realignment, and quite frankly, I don't think that any of the presidential candidates is capable of leading it, the way FDR did that last one.  But that's okay--if we can learn how to step up from below in ways that haven't been imagined yet.

Lateral Empowerment

Above all, what I think we need to be about is lateral empowerment--all manner of ways of strengthen bonds between us as equals, in opposition to the hierarchical relations that current prevail.  It's not that all hierarchy is bad, it's simply that the balance needs to be radically shifted away from the extreme preponderance that hierarchies hold today.

OpenLeft already has some practices (such as the right of response) that support this process, as well as discussions and even processes (Legislation 2.0) that point in this direction.  I'd like to see us have some more explicit discussion of what the big picture entails.

Reforming Government to Empower People

For example, one thought that came out of Chris's post-2004 election analysis was the idea of growing liberalism was to strongly align with reforming government.  This is a very different strategy than simpler-minded "libertarian Democrats" approach, but if done properly it will actually deliver a good deal of the "libertarian Democrats" crowd is really after: Structures of governance that are flexible and responsive, which help us collective share risk, amortize costs, and plan for the long-range future in ways that leave us freer in our everyday lives, knowing that we have input into and confidence in the larger structures necessary to deal with things that individuals can't deal with alone.

I think Chris was 100 percent right about this alignment, and I'd like to see renewed discussion of it here.

Good government can bring us dramatically increased transparency, universal connectivity and health care, and shifts in subsidy structures that accelerate the transition to an environmentally sustainable future, rather than continue paying tribute to the polluters and poisoners of the past.

Other Than That...

Nothing much, I guess.  Can someone tell Soapy to fix the bugs that don't allow percent signs or ampersands in comments?

"You know what they say -- those of us who fail history... doomed to repeat it in summer school." -- Buffy The Vampire Slayer, Season 6, Episode 3

FDR wasn't FDR either (0.00 / 0)
I really think we're at a point of potential political realignment of the sort this country hasn't seen since 1932.  I think we desperately need such a realignment, and quite frankly, I don't think that any of the presidential candidates is capable of leading it, the way FDR did that last one.  But that's okay--if we can learn how to step up from below in ways that haven't been imagined yet.

Every few years, I reread some of Arthur M. Schlesinger Jr.'s Age Of Roosevelt books, in particular, The Crisis of the Old Order.  Message to take home: liberals and radicals were lukewarm about the guy during the 1932 election, and with good reason.  FDR ran on a balanced budget platform, and it took a while before he became the populist we remember.

I suspect that Obama, or even Clinton, can surprise us upon taking office, as long as we work to keep their feet to the fire.

[ Parent ]
Except That (4.00 / 1)
FDR had already shown his progressive instincts as governor of NY, and in his "Forgotten Man" speech.  What he'd also shown was a degree of political caution that frustrated many. But at the same time it was frustrating progressives, it was frightening conservatives so much that they soon started plotting a military coup to get rid of him.

Furthermore, he had shown the same pattern in NY.  He had to strike a deal with Tammany Hall to win the governor's race in 1928.  But once he was safely and handily re-elected in 1930, he turned on them. 

Obama seems to move the other way.  He was more progressive as a candidate than he's been as a Senator.  That's what concerns me.

Also, the lack of a strong movement to his left.  Roosevelt knew he could safely move to his left because of the labor movement.  I not only doubt that Obama even wants to move to his left, I can't see anything like the 1930s labor movement to encourage him to do so.

"You know what they say -- those of us who fail history... doomed to repeat it in summer school." -- Buffy The Vampire Slayer, Season 6, Episode 3

[ Parent ]
Well, there's folks like us (0.00 / 0)
I think there are two answers to your concerns about Obama.

First, while labor is weaker as a political force (we should be careful here also: the great strikes that made the labor movement in the US didn't start happening until the middle of FDR's first term), I think that the Citizen's Movement, which is what the netroots really is, has created a center for organizing and "loyal opposition" that can pull a lot of that weight.  And if we can remove some of the legal obstacles to industrial organization, labor itself will take a stronger role.

Second, I don't think that the "soul of the party" will be fought over in the Democratic Primary this time. On the contrary, we can do more by lighting fires under the House and Senate by working between now and the summer of 2008 to put forward progressive candidates on both the state and federal level.

I'd particularly emphasize the importance of this in what we used to call the "Swing States".  I put that in quotes because I suspect that some of the classic swing states, like Ohio, are not anywhere as much in play this time around.  By concentrating on state and lower-ballot federal races in in states like Ohio and Minnesota, we can help make these states less friendly for the presidential race as well.

Were I an Obama-partisa, which I'm not, I could probably also point to biographical details to suggest more optimism.  I suspect that Democratic senators who held office in the 1920s were not all that bold either, and that a portion of Obama's caution comes from the institutional challenges of running from the Senate, as well.

[ Parent ]
Agree with soyinkafan (0.00 / 0)
about the Durbin/Net legislation project. It's something I care about but not something I want to spend detail time on. I do want to know that people who do care about the details have similar goals as mine and for that I am very glad for all the access that Senator Durbin is able to provide.

So as the effort moves to its own spaces and tools I would hope that regular "executive" reports would appear here and that the process would remain open to newcomers just finding out about it.

Jeff Wegerson

feedback (4.00 / 1)
I really think you need a better tool(s) (and I posted one possible previously) for something as complex as net neutrality and build up a broadband policy generally.  Especially to write up actual legislation and policy. 
It's too dense to me to be formulated in a typical AJAX comment thread.

I find the discussion fascinating, I think fundamentally this is a great idea and Durbin knocked my socks off by initiating it....but I have issue with technically incorrect commentary and hardly anyone being aware it is technically incorrect. 

I think you need some real network/engineering experts who are not working for ATT, Verizon, Sprint et al to comment.  I suggest the IEEE and I also suggest DARPA.  There are also some from Academia.

How to get world leading experts who do not have a vested corporate interest to comment openly on a blog?  I don't know but an invite might be a good 1st step.

A policy that is legislating technology....to me it's a must to understand that technology, objectively, in depth and down to the nibble (half a byte).


NoSlaves.com  


The Economic Populist

Doing fine (4.00 / 2)
That's all.
I agree (0.00 / 0)
with Skeptic that you are doing just fine.  You are doing alot better than I am doing right now because I signed up for this site when I was told on Facebook.  I was in Peru at the time and for the life of me could not remember my password.

Absolutely no problems retrieving it. (Manan Canchu)

If not NOW, when?

Stay Sharp And Avoid Complacency (4.00 / 1)
I came to OpenLeft specifically because it was devoted to the idea of building new progressive policies and sharing ideas. I'm sick to death of the constant numbers-crunching and horse-race stuff, and I'm glad to see a much broader focus and stronger vision here.

You raise a good point about the "institutionalization" of the top blogs, and it's important to remember that no institution lasts forever. Just as YouTube and other video sharing services are taking the blogosphere's capabilities to a new level, something will come along that trumps YouTube. The blogs themselves are the same way. If Kos, Arianna, Josh and the like don't continue to innovate and keep challenging themselves and their audiences, they'll lose readers. The fact that John Aravosis, one of the biggest names in Left Blogistan, still has to resort to funding drives to pay for site improvements is a sad commentary on fickle audiences--and advertisers.

And don't underestimate the desire for new voices--my own group blog is doing pretty darn well for being a recent launch in a crowded field: http://scholarsandro...

Keep pushing the boundaries and challenging people, and the audiences will find you.

Durbin discussion thoughts (0.00 / 0)
I'll certainly agree the discussion took a relatively large commitment to follow and participate in.  I thought it was important to do so, so I spent several hours a day on it all week.  It felt kind of like a part-time job, actually.

Most days, the subject matter was advanced enough that we only had a handful of educated people on the topic (and I don't consider myself one, but I tried to participate anyway).  The bar on the discussion was pretty high.  But I do think this is the way to educate people, and allowing people to lurk (a "fly on the wall") is very good, in the long run.

To make it more interesting for the high lurker/poster ratio, I wish some of the experts would have questioned each other a bit more, as a few of them never posted anything more than "hi, I'm here".

One suggestion would be to explicitly leave conversation open for a full evening, rather than saying it's 7:00-7:45 or whatever.  One of the reasons the Internet works so well is that it makes time shifting is easy, allowing people to do work when they have time without requiring everyone to leave a specific time slot open.  Implicitly setting an end to the discussion made it really die out, after only 45 minutes, while the west coast techies still weren't off work yet.  Sure, there was some activity afterwards, but I think explicitly saying "all evening" would be helpful, or at least a 4-6 hour window.

A few other thoughts:
* do intensive discussions every other day, or at least, post the 3-4 proposals/background papers the day _before_ the discussion.  Some of these were quick reads, but others had a number of supporting studies and papers to read/skim.  It just took a while to get through them, let alone discuss them on the diary page before the main discussion (especially if you liked the paper!).

* although you did highlight all the day's reading, it was a little hard to follow in your text.  I recommend using bullet points or something for the 3 or 4 professional opinions of the day.

Sure, it's been a little rough around the edges, but I think you guys are doing a great job!  I'm sure watching the technorati number rise to the 10,000's now is for you to see

Punditry is easy: doing something constructive is quite difficult.  This first Durbin discussion may not mean much in the long run, but it's a step into uncharted territory, and hopefully one in the right direction.  To think we would solve anything in 4 days is folly: where do we go from here?

One question: looking at your web stats, can you tell how many people read the Durbin discussions?  There were probably only 40-50 people that posted over the course of the 4 days, and I'm hoping there were at least a few thousand that hit the discussion pages.

end the occupation of Iraq

more questions than answers (0.00 / 0)
Well I honestly don't get it yet.
  Maybe I have not spent enough time at the site.  I agree that you haven't found your voice yet and there is still something rocky about it.  I thought you and Chris Bowers were both extemely powerful on the other blog.  From my point of view as an older progressive Democrat I was just so grateful for the new life being blown into the Democratic Party parameters, and for the incisiveness of your analyses.  I have said this several times before on the mydd site -- I thought you were both right on and you were both very effective-- perhaps more so than you acknowleged. 
You have explained that you have a different,
  wider vision in starting this site.  I don't get it yet.  I worry about it.  I don't know why you will feel freer here to build new coalitions -- but obviously you know that is so.
I trust you both and admire your work so much that I will hang around and hope I catch on.
a couple of website rec's (4.00 / 1)
1- get a flavicon for the site.  They look good and are easy.

2- added an extended entry 1-click (so that you don't have to change pages to read the rest of a post).  Thinkprogress has one & they're on wordpress, and Ezra Klein has one, and he's on typepad.  I know there are lots of plugins that do just that out there. 

This was a complaint of mine in MyDD too, but less so.  On OL, however, it seems almost every post has an extended entry, and the whole reason I like OL is that you write long engaging posts.  But clicking through 15 pages just to read your site can be really annoying- and I don't like using bloglines to read this much text either. 

thanks. 

^ what he said (0.00 / 0)
Great suggestions from Nebraska.

Make no small plans.
[ Parent ]
The two faces of the issue (0.00 / 0)
As a blog, I love this.  The contrasts from the current state of MyDD are huge and it is a vast improvement. 

As a part of a progressive blogosphere, I would like to see Tom Allen outfundraise Susan Collins to show her she has a couple drops left to sweat. 

How's the site? (0.00 / 0)
I'm finding my CPU is pegged when posting comments because of all the YouTubes.

Can you fix that on your site?

firefox fix (0.00 / 0)
If you're using FireFox, download the FlashBlock plugin.  It will display a triangle "play" sign instead of automatically loading flash file.  If you click on it, then the flash file will actually load.

http://flashblock.mo...

If you're not, download firefox first:

http://www.getfirefo...

end the occupation of Iraq

[ Parent ]
I liked Legislation 2.0 (4.00 / 1)
I think it is a great project. I had no trouble following the discussion. I'm pretty technical, and have been working with the internet since the 70's (it had different names before.) Still, I did not have questions that some expert on net neutrality had not already posted. I thought it was very exciting to follow the direct discussions with Senator Durbin. Now I have a new favorite Senator from Illinois. :-)

In general, I like what you guys are doing with the site. You are definitely carving out a new niche, and I like the idea of direct involvement (rather than just grousing.)

As a fan of both Matt and Chris's posts, it has been a net gain that you guys split off from mydd. They have filled in the gap at mydd with a collection of great new front pagers, and now I have a new favorite site here at openleft.

Legislation 2.0 (0.00 / 0)
I didn't have time to read through all the Durbin discussion, but it is a great idea.

I've been thinking for several years that there needs to be some way for a large number of people on the web to work together to make decisions. Blogs are good for discussions, but there is no easy way to pull everything toether at the end. It occured to me that we need new web software that would duplicate the processes developed by meeting facilitators. One method that I like, and that might work well on the web, is described in the 1976 book How to Make Meetings Work: The New Interaction Method by Doyle and Straus. I explain it in even more detail in my paper The AD Method of Cooperative Decision-Making (pdf). By clearly laying out all the different options and their advantages and disadvantages (benefits and pitfalls), it is much easier to choose or to blend ideas together. Perhaps there is some way to build an AD chart using a wiki-like structure so that people could build it together (and yet it is not subject to sabotage). Once the options are laid out, then people could discuss and modify. Then finally, there could be a poll to choose the best option.

This site is wonderful (0.00 / 0)
I'm glad I became aware of it as early as I did, and am sharing it with friends.  I've been looking for a forum such as this for quite some time; the "institutional" blogs, while great for what they are, often restrict the discourse into specific avenues.  I have high hopes that this open forum can expand beyond partisan rhetoric and delve more into the philosophical and ideological underpinnings of the contemporary American Left as we relate them to ongoing political and social movement matters.

Ideally this site will be a center for clarification and understanding, as those of us who are "confused about politics" touch base with one another and explore our collective values. 

Excellent start (0.00 / 0)
I think the broadband discussion was a great start. It brought in a lot of knowledgeable people who can actually do something about US communications policy. However, the implication I got was that this was a way to shoot ideas to Durbin so he can write legislation. I think what we really need is a medium through which we write the legislation, or at least the essentials of it without the boilerplate.

What is missing, seems it me, is a way to follow up. Broadband policy is only one example of critical issues that require more basic discussion, more working through alternative visions, than even a several-day session can provide. There are basic philosophical assumptions that have to be worked out -- for example, can broadband access be defended as a fundamental right? What is the best balance between public-utility/public-service/corporate-provided models? And many more. From consensus on these basic assumptions, hopefully, effective and marketable legislation can arise.

I hope the next step is a permanent sub-site that summarizes the discussion and makes the entire exchange readily accessible. Something set up as a working group for sorting out the basics with a view to coming up with specific legislative proposals. It would also be a place to get responses from Senator Durbin and others on the feasibility of the proposals and compromises he might see as politically necessary. In other words, a feedback mechanism for development of real-world legislation and a base for catching up with the right in development of effective propaganda for our side.

With any luck, such a setup could serve as a testbed for the many other issues that need more attention than partisan gotcha poltics and special-interest lobbying can supply -- taxes, the safety net, voting, the structure of government come to mind. I suppose what I'm saying amounts to a kind of shadow government with plugins to parts of the real thing. Such a move would require moving away from being a foregone ally of the Democratic Party and a commitment to thinking about genuinely radical change. Whether that's in the cards here would be, in itself, the subject of a very interesting discussion.

New tools and tasks for netroots next steps (0.00 / 0)
I tend to agree with DaveW and a few other commenters about the need for follow-up to  Leg 2.0 discussions.  This would include more and better tools for moving from discussion threads toward legislative goals, as well as additional person-time to sift through all the comments and generate reasonably detailed and organized summaries of the issues, proposed solutions, action items, etc.

To date, the netroots has shown a growing capacity to raise money and influence mass media and Congress, while also allowing many more people to feel engaged and empowered.

The Leg 2.0 project and assorted other efforts, including those of the Sunlight Foundation, point to a next phase in the netroot's evolution.  I don't know if that's where OL wants or should go, but I do think its one of the most important areas of future development.

I'd suggest working on an ongoing collaborative basis with Sen. Durbin and any others in Congress that value this potential, along with organizations like Sunlight, Congresspedia, etc.

Leveraging and coordinating with existing tool-development within the netroots (e.g., Sunlight Labs) seems like something that could generate high returns on investment.  The same might be true of time spent taking raw discussions and turning them into concise summaries and follow-up action items--especially if this was done in tandem with the incorporation of new process-related tools.

Both of these task areas could potentially be handled by multi-person groups of volunteers.  These could either share the tasks fairly evenly, or maybe have one or a few people doing most of the work, with a larger number of volunteers reviewing them and providing feedback.  If it was the latter model, it'd be nice to be able to pay the folks carrying most of the load enough to enable them to stay focused and still pay their bills.  There's a lot of knowledgeable and motivated volunteer energy out here, but without suitable tools and focused follow-up, a lot of that energy becomes dissipated as heat.  We need better ways to more efficiently harness it.  I think the Leg 2.0 discussions were both a step in that direction, and a reminder that more is needed.

[ Parent ]
How Are We Doing? | 29 comments
Donate to Open Left









QUICK HITS

Friends of the Earth thanks the OpenLeft community for the ideas you generate and your contributions to the progressive movement.
As an anti-spam measure, there is a 24-hour waiting period after registering before new users can comment.
blog advertising is good for you
blog advertising is good for you
LIBERAL INSTITUTIONS
STATE BLOGS
SEARCH

   

Advanced Search

Home | RSS/XML Feed | Register | Contact

  © OpenLeft 2007-2009, Powered by SoapBlox