Effects of defeat on political parties 2010 updated version

by: Daniel De Groot

Wed Nov 10, 2010 at 16:30


In 2008, I wrote Defeat pushes parties towards the victors in an effort to spell out what I saw (and still see) as the futility of 3rd party spoiler politics as a vehicle for changing the Democratic party:


The basic problem is that voting is a very blunt instrument for influencing policy.  You may be sending a message, but it is not heard clearly and usually misinterpreted.  The other problem is that this theory is based on entirely too much reification of parties.  We discuss them sometimes as if they are coherent even monolithic actors, but this just isn't so.  The Democratic party does not have a brain and nervous system that reacts to stimuli like a person might.

The thesis was that defeated political parties tend to move toward the ideology of the party that won, because that's where the votes are.  Since then, the behaviour of the Republicans after successive defeats in 2006 and 2008 would seem to have shot a gaping hole in that.  After all, in no way did the Republicans even entertain the idea of moving toward the Democrats and the few who suggested anything like that (say David Frum) are now outcasts on the right.  So what gives?

Daniel De Groot :: Effects of defeat on political parties 2010 updated version
It turns out that there is a deep literature on the subject in formal political science circles, and as summarized by UCLA Professor John Zaller to a class of his I listened to in podcast, the thinking is that it often takes sustained and severe defeats to produce the effect.  That makes a lot more sense.  At risk of reifying parties, a person who has long succeeded doing a particular thing will probably not give up that tactic on the first or even second failure.  

In more systemic terms, the literature suggests (quite plausibly) that for a variety of reasons it is difficult to turn a party around that is out of step with the electorate.  Reformers will easily find themselves cast out for getting too far from the acceptable norms, and a wary public will hardly ever deliver immediate electoral rewards to reformers early enough for them to survive challenges by the old guard who may pull the party back into the previous established mode.   As early reformers get shown the door, other reform minded individuals may bite their tongues for fear of the same.  Most of this is fairly predictable human groupthink behaviour.  It's particularly easy to see all this happening on the right where orthodoxy and slavish adherence to prescribed ideas are themselves ideals.  

That last though suggests the real flaw in my 2008 piece:  I was forgetting the left/right asymmetry.  They're not the same and I think the past 3 cycles demonstrate that.  Two consecutive wave defeats giving the Democrats popular vote majorities at all levels in addition to congressional majorities larger than Republicans have held since before the Great Depression would certainly have the Democrats whimpering had they been on the receiving end, yet the Republicans just turned the crazy knob past 11 and the bad economy (and bad policy) delivered for them.  Meanwhile Obama continues to lecture about the urgent need for entitlement reform, HAMP is still a failure, and the odds of letting the Bush tax cuts for the rich expire are pretty slim.  When Republicans lost seats in the 1998 midterms, they impeached Clinton. Clearly my 2008 theory does not apply evenly to left and right.  

The downside of right wing resistance to ideological moderation in the face of crushing electoral defeats is obvious.  The upside would take place if the Democrats could ever get their acts together a la FDR - it took 5 successive defeats - nearly 20 years of Democratic trifecta rule before the Republicans delivered the New Deal accepting Ike in the midst of the Korean war to finally pull off a win.  Even so they could not hold on to Congress for decades following which suggests that their ability to coordinate on moderate Presidential candidates acceptable to the post New Deal electorate, like Ike and Nixon did not extend well to the Congressional level, where the crazies still dominated.  That could happen again if the left can understand the asymmetries and exploit conservative weaknesses rather than trying to ape their tactics.

The key is just to get the Democrats to start acting like Democrats and actually advocating and implementing good policy that actually fixes stuff.  You know, liberalism.  Details...


Tags: , , , , , (All Tags)
Print Friendly View Send As Email
lord, it's not that complicated. (4.00 / 2)
(and don't get me wrong, i lurv High Theory and making things way too complicated, lol)

but the truth is found in one simple word: money. the last ~40 years or so have seen a tremendous shift in wealth distribution. only the upper classes have seen any growth, and that growth has been spectacular. with that wealth, being greedy and wanting more, they have used that to buy media outlets, politicians, and many campaign ads. they took advantage of the backlash among the Birchers to the successes of the civil rights movement, and convinced a lot of crazies to run as republicans on bircher style issues, starting at the level of school boards and state reps. they built a solid machine which eventually consumed the republican party of the previous time, and created the neofascist monster we grapple with today. remember that the uber rich aren't generally politicians themselves, they buy puppets and actors and hire strategists to write scripts to be read on TV.  and the very rich have realized that by destroying quality public education in this country, and with the advent of cable "24/7 news" TV, how easy it is to do all the things they've done that are destroying american representative democracy and widely shared prosperity. the dems are not really that different than the republicans in this sense. they may be stupid, but the rules of the campaign are unchanged: media access and saturation. that costs money. so they suck up to those who can give them some. those people are not "liberal" or "progressive" for the most part. citizens united is the final nail in that coffin, btw. it was very clear this cycle and will be even more clear in the next. if a democrat wins, it's because the rich realize that americans aren't quite cowed enough (yet) to accept a formally one party state. so we'll get some democratic victories which accomplish little to nothing in progressive terms. and we'll continue to have spoiler "blue dogs" or somesuch within the party itself.

money. you and i ain't got it. therefore, little we want will be granted by "our" political class. there's the whole "shallowness of Villagers" argument but that's less important than what i just wrote.  


there (0.00 / 0)
Was lots of money among the rich in 1932, 1936.  FDR wasn't railing about the Malefactors of Great Wealth for nothing.  Why were the Democrats better then?   I can probably make reasonable explanations for the differences, but the point is money is an oversimplification.  It matters a lot but it isn't the only thing going on.  

I'm with Einstein on this one, things should be as simple as they can be, but no more.  I'm not persuaded to buy into a monocausal explanation even if money is 60% of the equation, human stuff is still there.


[ Parent ]
In 1932, 1936 (4.00 / 1)
there was revolution in the wind, or at least a whiff of it.  That trumped the power of money.  Money got SCARED.

Now, nothing to be afraid of, so money talks and keeps on talkin.  I'm with Chicago Dyke on this one.  

Have you read Winner-Take-All Politics yet, Daniel?  It explains what we're seeing much better than anything else I've read recently.

sTiVo's rule: Just because YOU "wouldn't put it past 'em" doesn't prove that THEY did it.


[ Parent ]
were they better? (0.00 / 0)
In terms of the direction they were heading, they were much much much better.  But that's only on economic issues and confined to American workers.  On identity issues (which at the time meant 'lynchings'), they were much worse for a long time.  Both are important.

Anyway, I think the answer to your question can be found in some of the stuff I was reading when Obama made his idiotic comment about FDR allgedly intentionally triggering social upheaval.  FDR didn't intend to start fast but when he saw how compliant Congress was, he sped things up.  Obama didn't have that option.

It doesn't excuse him, because he didn't do as much as he could even within what was available to him, I think, but it does explain some of the difference.  It's not just that the Democrats are worse now or the President is worse now, but that all of American politics is much much worse and there hasn't been the backlash to make 'our leaders' wise up.

And on a related aside, what would the equivalent of late 19th century and early 20th century activism be today?  There are no workers in the U.S. getting shot to protect or establish their rights.  There is barely even a peep outside of the rightwing!


[ Parent ]
Lynchings (0.00 / 0)
Sorry but that is questionable.  FDR tried to get an anti-lynching bill; when he could'nt do it, he resorted to administrative action and pressure, which resulted in lynchings massively declining between 1935 and 1955, to virtual nothing.

[ Parent ]
okay how about segregation, internments, etc. (0.00 / 0)
Your point is fair in that I don't know enough about this to refute it, but the general point is true, no?  It's just a cautionary note about idolizing and viewing political factions as heroic when they were rooted in a particular context parts of which we may not like.   As such: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/U... (see the South, year chosen from midterm non war years at random)

In terms of analysis, not idolizing at minimum opens up interesting avenues.  It's not to take anything away from FDR , who I agree was far more effective a politician/president than Obama especially on class issues and in that he didn't have time for institutional constraints and found his way around them.  It's more of an appraisal of the system and the method used to challenge it from contemporary eyes.


[ Parent ]
"Clearly my 2008 theory does not apply evenly to left and right." (4.00 / 1)
This should probably read:

"Clearly my 2008 theory does not apply evenly to left and right over the period 1998 to 2010, substituting Democrats and Republicans for 'left' and 'right'."

If you look at things over the course of a party system, it makes more sense and what you're describing happens at one point in the process.  Namely, a party that used to be in the ascendancy and suffers repeated defeats eventually starts mimicking the other party.  But in between, it usually ups the 'crazy' (which is usually wahtever the 'center' thinks is crazy).  e.g. the Democrats in the 1970s.  It took the Democrats from 1968 until 1994 to fully commit ideological suidice (in order to not ecommit electoral suicide).  And I would expect the Republicans to take a similar length of time, unless things have really changed a lot.

That's why where the 'center' is in practice, who controls it, and in how it's defined is so important - probably much more so than whoever wins a particular election cycle, in my opinion.  Both parties will, over the course of decades, either gravitate towards the center or die, relative to each other.  

But that's relative to each other - the actual contents of what 'the center' means can shift dramatically due to entirely different circumstances (the kinds of structural changes that chicago_dyke alluded to like citizens united or the place of the u.s. in the world or or the fall of the Soviet Union or deindustrialization or the growth of the military in american society or a lot of other things).


The GOP lost because the visibly hurt America (0.00 / 0)
They finally went too fast, and people could sense the damage.

Obama and co. have slowed the damage down and masked the damage by a record expansion of debt, but the people still see it.

Just as Democrats won by default in 2006, 2008 (nobody really supports them) the same can be said about the GOP in 2010.

We need to be talking about systemic reforms on the level of Constitutional Amendments and Conventions, not sissying around talking about personalities or individual bills and issues.


Left-right asymmetry is crucial (0.00 / 0)
After all, we're a conservative country, so anytime anyone loses, that means they have to go right...right?

Reclaim the ideological landscape for liberalism and win the hearts and minds of the people, and we win this war.






USER MENU


blog advertising is good for you
blog advertising is good for you

Donate to Open Left

QUICK HITS
SEARCH

   

Advanced Search

STATE BLOGS